YPAP leader Sinha Shekhar now wants HDB to forbid home buyers from selling subsidised flats at higher prices in open market

sinhapicControversial YPAP leader and new citizen from India Mr Sinha Shekhar now wants HDB to forbid home buyers from selling their subsidised flats in the open market at higher prices.

Mr Sinha Shekhar sparked a massive outcry among Singaporeans last month when his comments on the YPAP Facebook calling PAP critics as “DOGS” were reported in the media:

[Source: YPAP Facebook]

Mr Sinha Shekhar had initially said he would clarify his infamous “DOGS” remarks to the public, but has yet to do so.

After “hiding” for a month in the hope that his misdeeds will be forgotten, he now makes a “grand” appearance on the YPAP Facebook again with a different profile picture:

sinhasubsidy

Mr Sinha Shekhar is writing in response to PAP National Development Minister Mah Bow Tan’s recent comment that a “HDB flat is for long-term homeownership.

He probably mooted the idea as he had bought a resale flat at a high price a few years ago and the rent he is collecting now is insufficient to pay for the bank instalments, in his own words:

sinhaproperty

[Source: REACH Facebook]

In the above exchange, Mr Sinha also revealed that he owns a private property, implying that he bought the resale HDB flat NOT for staying but for renting and making money.

His admission prompted one netizen to write in to HDB which replied that it has granted Mr Sinha Shekhar “special permission” to rent out his flat, infuriating the latter who threatened to sue the whistle-blower for slander.

Strictly speaking, a person living in a private property is NOT allowed to sublet his HDB flat. However, Mr Sinha Shekhar may be given preferential treatment as he is a YPAP and grassroots leader.

A speech therapist by training, Mr Sinha Shekhar obtained his Singapore citizenship in 1994 at 25 years of age. He joined the PAP four years later, rising fast high up its rank to become its most prominent face in cyberspace. He is currently the Head of Rehabilitation at Ang Mo Kio Community Hospital. He did not serve a SINGLE day of National Service.

Despite his callous remarks against fellow Singaporeans, he remains influential in the YPAP and continues to enjoy tacit support from YPAP Chairman Teo Ser Luck and his deputy Zaqy Mohamad who are strangely silent on his latest outburst in cyberspace.

Faced with fast eroding support from native Singaporeans, the PAP has no choice but to rely increasingly on the new citizens like Mr Sinha Shekhar to shore up its support base.

 

 

 

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Related articles:

1. YPAP leader Sinha Shekhar blamed Singaporeans for misunderstanding him

2.YPAP leader Sinha Shekhar threatened to sue whistle-blower for slander

3. YPAP leader Sinha Shekhar complains about low rent of his resale HDB flat

4. YPAP leader Sinha Shekhar described PAP critics as “DOGS”

5. YPAP leader Sinha Shekhar urged CDCs to reach out to immigrants

6. Indian new citizen Sinha Shekhar scolds unemployed Singapore NSman

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65 Responses to “YPAP leader Sinha Shekhar now wants HDB to forbid home buyers from selling subsidised flats at higher prices in open market”

  • Man From U.N.C.L.E.:

    Next thing you know, Kaninna Shekar will want to run for mayor. (Yes we do have a mayor in Singapore.

  • Grace:

    ……You don’t have to bark at them!!oh man,Our goverment sure is strange.They let in dogclass foreigners as speech therapist who BARKS?!BOOF BOOF!.

  • SureOrNot?:

    This reminds me of a popular song by Baha Men, ‘Who let the dogs out?’

    This pedigree is definitely too domesticated to even attempt to use the organ between his ears. Please Mr Speech Therapist, look into a mirror 1st, not a webcam.

  • jaywalker:

    How did we ever let such pariahs into our country, it beats me. It reflects badly on those that allow it.

    Please give him the boot or at least kick him in his teeth so he speaks no more.

    If you are so great go back to your own country and show your worth before you come here with your shit!

  • wakakaka:

    OMG!!! Who let this sinha dog out? his master mah sing, he follow immediately!!!

    Seriously i will spit at him when i see him in public thats for sure…

  • darren:

    I am utterly disappointed by the fact that Mr Sinha Ninama has not served a single day of National Service and yet he is commenting on our national policies.

    I would like to propose that foreigner should be barred from purchasing our HDB flats. They should only be allowed to rent our HDB flats or purchase their private apartments. The exception should only be made for workers working in sectors

  • Michael:

    He shld be forbidden for selling his private property for a profit! That will hurt him where it matters!

    Hahahaha!

  • Billy:

    Why so worked up over a silly proposal by Sinha? This type of nonsense I don’t think the govt would even waste time thinking about. PAP would not commit political suicide lah. Just ignore Sinha. You’re just giving him free publicity.

  • atobe:

    Sinha Shekhar never fail to live up to his own dogged reputation as a dog in sheep’s wool, and succeeding to pull the wool on his YPAP sponsors’ eyes.

    Prevent HDB dwellers from selling subsidized flats at higher prices in open market and achieve personal wealth ?

    Is this the kind of talent that the Pro Alien Party claimed to be attracting into Singapore ?

    With a “daft” brain displayed repeatedly, it looks like Sinha Shekhar is not too clever to succeed in politics – how did he managed to hoodwink those “daft” Singaporeans working in the Pro Alien Party ?

  • ddd:

    why not he suggest home buyers of subsidised flats who are new citizens to be taxed so that they don’t make a profit out of the new flat?

  • ddd:

    counting on new citizens to defend s’pore’s interest is an illusion.

  • Pink:

    How about we also impose 30% tax on people who rent out their hdb while owning private property (like him)?

    He’s just throwing a smoke bomb to improve his popularity, hoping PAP will make him a candidate in the coming GE and be a MP who earns >10K monthly LOL. Sorry he wait long long, it’s too late, PAP won’t pick a man who sprouts nonsenses all the time and offends citizens hahaha.

  • SianTou:

    In other countries, public housing is only for citizen and not for foreigners like PR. PR is still the citizen of another countries! Only uniquely in Singapore, PR is considered as local. PAP government likes to twist and turn to classify PR as local so as to cover up their failure in national policy e.g. the IR job mostly goes to PR but by disguising PR as local, PAP government tries to hide from the fact that little/no benefit is rendered to the true Singaporean!

  • Pink:

    A pot is calling the kettle black. He claimed a HDB is not for speculation and profit. Then why is he renting out his hdb to earn profit?

  • Fallon:

    Is he STILL thinking of himself after the lambasting by Sgporeans over his previous comments?…. So now he is taking up the case against Sgporean buyers who buy new subsidized HDB flats and then selling in the open market for “speculation or making profits” (even after minimum holding period- well, not to debit the merits of for or against as that is not the point here)? One wonders whether his real intent of such new found civic mindedness is in fact actual self-serving in disguise to advocate a limitation in HDB resale supply, so that his own resale flat can rise in value as a result?

  • peaceBwithU:

    who is this sinha shekhar?
    seriously, why hdb approve to let him rent out his hdb? this is against the rule right?
    thought ppl who own any private property and hdb flat MUST stay in hdb?

  • peaceBwithU:

    Well, unless the private property he is staying right now is not own by him but is a quarters provided by his employer.
    Anyone knows on what excuse he has given to hdb to get approval to sublet his flat?

  • stormlab:

    pro pap doesn’t make one Human~

    it only makes it an Obedient Hound~

    Sit! Hand! Roll Over! Beg! Play Dead!…Stop Humpin’ my leg!

  • LPPL:

    DOGS wont change their shit-eat habits. Now this dog wants to bark some more!

  • Guys, here’s another YPAP Pariah. Just read what he is saying and you would be wondering if PAP is training their youths to be like mini-LKYs?

    From PAP facebook – http://www.facebook.com/pap.sg?v=wall&story_fbid=136626829701073

    Sin Rak Sin
    Yeah ,Peace so no fixing of opps parties. No hatre of alternative voices.
    Wednesday at 10:23am

    Jack Lin Xinli
    Ask them to stop hating first. Everything also wanna vote against.
    Wednesday at 1:05pm

    Kojak Bt
    ý@Jack, I believe we are living in a democratic republic here. People are free to vote against things if they don’t like it.
    Wednesday at 3:14pm

    Jack Lin Xinli
    Oh kojak, we are democratic? Then how come TR and TOC and opposition deny so? :) Its democratic, we are free to fix the oppositions and free to sue unsubstantiated defamatory voices, if u wan u can defend urself in court.
    Yesterday at 11:05am

    Sin Rak Sin
    Jack can u do any better than the usual tactic of threatening to fix and sue?
    6 hours ago

    Kojak Bt
    @Jack – “Oh kojak, we are democratic? Then how come TR and TOC and opposition deny so?”

    I don’t speak for TR or TOC. Why don’t you go ask them? Speaking for myself, it’s democratic as long as it’s still a one man one vote system – although I must also say that PAP, thruout the years, has been trying to “fidget” with the system to increase PAP’s chance of winning… enough said.

    “:) Its democratic, we are free to fix the oppositions and free to sue unsubstantiated defamatory voices, if u wan u can defend urself in court.”

    HAHA! This is what I meant by “fidgeting”… Sure, go ahead and sue for every little things… but I’m also telling you, as the years go by, the electorates are more educated. Your suing can only backfire and serve to piss off more people. People know that in the first world countries, the ruling party doesn’t sue opponents for every little things. People are smart enough to see through the real reason for such political motivated lawsuits… good luck to PAP…
    21 minutes ago

  • This guy Jack Lin Xinli is a YPAP leader in Joo Chiat area, working under Chan Soo Sen:

    http://joochiat-yec.blogspot.com/2009/08/joo-chiat-yec-members.html
    Lin XinLi Jack (General Secretary)
    Joo Chiat YEC Members 2009

    http://joochiat-yec.blogspot.com/2009/03/jack-lin.html
    Jack Lin
    Posted by Friends of Joo Chiat CC YEC Friday, March 20, 2009
    Name: Jack Lin
    Position: General Secretary

    •Jack in NUS, majoring in economics.
    •Though new to YEC, he has been helping out under PAP Joo chiat for about a year and other committees.
    •He is active in his CCAs such as Ballroom Dancing and Toastmasters.
    •He enjoys political discourses and wishes to contribute to Singapore for the better.

  • Andrew Chuah:

    23/7/10

    I am not surprise with his latest statement and this is very uncalled for as our Modern Singapore is a free country and practise free economy where the highest bidder gets what he wants…….right….if anyone does not agree, please let me know. He is going against his own YPAP and PAP which is the ruling government of the day……sad to have such a low class talent as our new citizen.

    Regards
    Andrew Chuah
    Ordinary Singaporean

  • 超级白:

    @Kojakbt

    Lin Xinli?

    Does the name sounds like a PRC covert?

  • BooShit:

    Hello Sinha, if you hv so many unhappiness living in s’pore. Why continue staying here. You can always pack n leave the country. Ask yourself what hv you contribute to s’pore ??? Nothing !!! You only compliant, compliant n compliant. We don’t welcome YOU !!! BYE BYE !!!

  • TopQuitter:

    Hey Guys! Look, life in SG will not be getting easier everyday. We are not people with simple mindsets. I believe we know and expect what is coming up ahead. With such a high number of foreign talents in SG, Native Singaporeans will be an endangered species very soon.

    Also with the experience of witnessing so many past General Elections, we all know what the election results will be. You cannot fault the PAP for recruiting non-Native Singaporeans in their renewal process. ‘Talent’ like Sinha Shekhar will be on the increase. With so many dissenting voices and reluctance by Native Singaporeans to get involved in politics, PAP is just like any corporation trying to fight for its own survival. PAP is neither ignorant or in denial of the many dissenting and opposition voices that are populating the internet increasingly.

    So, my only answer is, if you cannot kick out the dominant party, then the only option left is to kick yourself out! and I had done that many years ago to NZ. Life is good…here! Goodluck mates!

  • raj:

    tis hindi fellow sinha is giving the local indians a very bad image,all the ah beng thinks all indian are stupid,y temsek giving this ass hole puplicity?

  • 2centsworth:

    1st of all, MBT said we should let market forces drive the price of resale flats. So now it is driven so high that is out of commoners reach. Now YP says do not allow subsidised flat owners to sell their flat in open market for a higher price, sell it at cost price. So, is HDB telling us the cost price of the flat? I only know my buy price.

    So tell me, which policy is better, HDB or YP or ??

    I am confused.

  • Ash Tong:

    He is Singaporean..ex CCHS

  • beetroot:

    # Sinha Sekhar….

    There is another way too…you tell Mah Bow Tan…

    Can ask all those who own private property to sell off thier HBD flats in about 5 years, back to HDB or in the open market.
    That way, we can use public housing for public housing.

  • NO WONDER he is an AWARD WINNING DOG. Master say what, he bark what.

    FT

    1st he say no profit, now cry mother cry father say profit too much. So fast forget what he said earlier on meh?

    I thought DOGs are supposed to have very good memory?

  • tiulunjiao:

    whoa, now he is suggesting another crap comments, so if any foreigners wanted to cash out and leave Singapore, all properities sold in the open market will be tax at 80% and all properities rented at open market will also be tax at 80%, at least must be fair to Singaporeans mah, enjoy so much already, so , you want or not ? Shekher ??

  • DonMakeSense:

    Hey, how come a foreigner can come here and make so much noise?

    Singaporeans, just give this guy hell and drive him out. Go to his work place and give him hell. Go to his home and give him hell.

    Someone please publish his address and work place here.

  • Hogzilla:

    I think this is what a certain ex-Taiwan Minister of Foreign Affairs meant by Po LP.

  • Wee SK:

    Shameless foreign trash!!!! This country can only get better if we have lesser of these shit. How to accomplish that is to show at the ballot box, the day when true blue S’poreans call the shots. Not opportunists, particularly those from India.

  • He is attacking the poor:

    You see how the caste systems in India happen naturally. It is deeply rooted right in their thought.

    Who get subsidized HDB in the first place? The poorest one. When the poor one sells and “make a profit” where he is going to? Goes to MBS or Singapore pools? or some loanshark? You think he can upgrade to condo like sinha? or you think the poor man will accepted in other countries for migration?

    Poor families supporting all the education industries by selling the properties and returned to homeless state and the money will feed all the rich one enjoy from stable income from education industries.

    Sinha plan to kill all the poor folks and reap their last chance of survival from selling the HDB and cash out for their next generation, make these people homeless and killed by the society.

  • Sinhaha dog:

    All true blue should remember this name–SEOW WEI SIN.
    Born in spore .
    Left country when he was ONE YEAR OLD.
    Return at 47 year old.
    DPP wanted to jail him for 3 years because he did not fulfill his NS obligations.Only crime–born with wrong sex organ.
    Compare this case with this doggie that is free-loading and maximizing the benefits of citizenship with ZERO NS obligation
    In any other country if you dare to call natural born dogs you would be IMMEDIATELY DEPORTED–after having your tail cut off.

  • LIONS ROAR:

    As a long time citizen whose ancestors sank their roots here a few generations ago,i would daringly ask for differentiations in treatment between old citizens and new shitizens and PRs who have purchased HDB FLATS.

    i think there should not be a simple across the board kind of treatment or rules and regulations between long time citizens and new ones as the older citizens have in general,pay much more SOCIAL COSTS.
    IN fact,i would say that since the FTs are so-called talents ,they shoudl be entering our job market a certain executive level and should not be allowed to buy HDB LOW COST HOUSING MEANT FOR OUR POORER CITIZENS.
    if FTs are allowed to buy HDBs,this implies to me that in fact ,theey are no talents as their base salaries are still in the lower income brackets.
    I would expect TALENTS supposedly more qualified than our owm locals to be able to afford private housing and not comepete with seemingly lower level income locals for HDB flats.
    if not,then,the whole FT IS JUST A BOG SCAM TO BRING IN CHEAP LABOURERS,NOT TALENTS and the govt should therefore,return all jobs to SINAGPOREANS.

  • nonsense:

    Riddle:
    How many bullets to load to shoot 10 foreign trash indians like this Silly-ha-ha?

    Answer: 40. One each between the eyes and one each for backup just in case they refuse to stay dead. Another 20 for the next new batch to come in thru MIW backside hole.

  • TKC:

    Kaninna Shekar is highly demanded in PAP. When minister WKS, LHL, Yakult, etc became speechless, he is the one manage to make these ministers start to talk rubbish.

  • anonymous:

    RSPCA tells us to be kind to animals. I agree. Let us keep all these imported foreign dogs in the kernels and feeding them with their favourite foods – kangaroo meats, lizard tails and dead cockroaches cooked in hotest curry.

    Angry foreign dogs are untamed, cunningly hypocritical and treacherously dangerous. They are like cut snakes still alive for a little longer but still deadly poisonous if it bites back at you. Mah bodo says so.

  • V:

    Or from China. I have the feeling that if a right-wing party were to be started in Singapore, many people would join, myself included. Come on people, who’s with me?

  • V:

    Let’s take back the country from the pigs who call themselves the ‘elite’. (Shades of Animal Farm?)

  • Dogs will be dogs:

    So many woof woof here. Keep on going for worthless shit. Dogs will be dogs.

  • anoni:

    See what this Sinner Shaker is trying to do?

    He has bought a HDB resale flat at high price.
    Now he wants those who bought flats at subsidized
    prices to resell them at those subsidized prices
    so that he can buy more and bring down his average
    price in order to invest more, with a guaranteed
    profit this time. He’s trying to tweak the system
    for his own selfish benefit.

    Clever isn’t he? I say too clever by half.

  • Shamuga Lee:

    Is he a grassroots leader ?
    If so, did he called someone a dog?
    If so, is this a respectable leader?

  • AMX-13:

    To Kojakbt

    Please continue with the good work to kick these idiots PAP
    clones asses!

    fan of Kojakbt

  • Bengseng:

    Yes of course,Dogs will always be dogs even when aboard.though you parasite us,your master to write,sad to SAY,you can only woof woof after all these years,when hungry for worthless shit.

  • Reposses Sinha flat as all PAP and opposition party agenda:

    Don’t drag it too long. Re-posses the flat and make him pay for fine and penalty as well. This will sound a big alarm and deterrence to future abuse.

    Bring down Sinha bring definitely win some % of confidence vote from the angry poor Singaporean. It can be opposition promise as well. If they win election, reposses Sinha ’s flat by law and overhaul HDB policies.

  • singaporefight:

    Even our local newspaper is taqken over by foreigners and new citizens they are worse running dogs then the previous running dogs then now become minister and MP.

    there will be blood soon, the temperature is rising just like the flood

  • annoyed reader:

    Is this article by Kojak? This is not serving TR much good.

    I thought it’s good idea to control the price for the benefit of Singaporeans. Isn’t that the same idea some people here suggested? I don’t get it. A different person saying the same idea and this correspondent is all heated against it.

    These personal fights are getting very tiring to watch.

  • Reposses Sinha flat as all PAP and opposition party agenda:

    Kojakbt:
    July 23, 2010 at 11:52 am
    Looking at these YPAP , no wonder LKY is willing to take risk to import FT the replace them. And LKY is assuming there is no better candidate than these YPAP future leaders.

    YPAP has taken for granted for the arrogant speech against the people. I thought sinha is only minority Thrash but looking at these talents no wonder Singapore is falling at faster pace. We are sleeping for too long think the next gen is better than the first gen LKY PAP.

  • Gatal Singaporeans:

    All Singaporean Chinese are from foreign country, China’s Hokkiean or Guangdong province. Most of their grandparents were not born in Singapore.

    Don’t gatal and attack others who coming now.

    At least now they come through the front door legally.

    He is successful and lives a better life than you are resulting in you jealous him now.

    Don’t blame anything or anybody. Blame yourself’s stupid and Gatal. pap not worrying because you always will feel gatal and vote them in GE.

  • meric:

    Pariah bhaayee India born bas3rd Sinha , now this rascal is interfering with our nations’ property and next this bhayee will interefere with the Singapore official Indian langugae asking Govt to take away Tamil and put his Pariah Hindi language .

    Now be it any Singaporean or any Singaporean bORN Indian, it is time to put a full stop to all this non N.S served rascals to comment on our status, regardless of Pariah fellows like nah beh Sinha or any new PRC

  • siao!:

    This mad man is stupid. Really stupid foreign talent.

    If he thinks the government is the type which would have listened to the public, he wouldn’t even have the chance to be in Singapore in the first place already!

    Cuz we would have already told the government so stop such idiots from coming in when the population was already at 3.5 million!

  • ddd:

    did anyone calculate?

    if his monthly rental income is about 1000 (for a 2 room flat), that should more than covers his 186989.97 loan at 2.6% over 20 years.

    The price of a 2 room flat is lower than 180K more than 5 years.

    I think it still is.

    IF his flat is 3 room, he can easily fetch 1500 a month, that should work out to be a 280K loan over 20 years.

    280K is the median price of a 3 room flat now.

    This fucker is lying when he says that his rents do not cover his mortgage.

  • Worst thanD@gs:

    A foreign dogs LICK-ing his Master boots ?? Being blunt just to gain publicity. Being out-spoken just to prove his existence.

    Being the worst street dogs looming around AMK daily, ‘he’ can only fooled people using his bad’Mouth’ but not any other forms.

    Pathetic dogs…..tsk tsk tsk….Woo! Woo! Woo!

  • Chicken Kali:

    every circus has its clowns

  • FedUpCitizen:

    The farking trouble with pap is that they keep changing the rules, usually benefiting themselves and the elite filty rich.
    HDB started as a public housing project and the original policy was that if you should get rich enough to buy a private property then you must sell your HDB flat.
    WTF, now if you own a private property you also can buy a hdb for investment and rent it out?? Or keep your HDb flat when you buy private properties??
    Fellow Singaporeans, we have to vote these bastards out.

  • Fark Foreigners!:

    When a black dogs bites at me, I will not sink to the level of biting it back…

  • PR CITIZEN:

    You singaporean dogs better start taking Sinha Sekhar seriously!!!! He is going to be a future MP. He has all the right ablities. Don’t you dare cross him or else all you Singaporeans will suffer more!!!!!

  • Frustrated:

    Go to the root of the problem, get rid of the people who invited him to our country in the first place. Time to vote them out in the coming elections.

  • Gatal Singaporeans:

    Can any gatal Singaporean who claimed he is true Singaporean denies his grandparents were from mainland China ?

    Scolding foreigners is like scolding your own grandparents.

    That’s why i said you are damn stupid and gatal. Only Melayu or the Malays are real true local. Get it, idiots ?

    If not ask any international well known historian or experts.

  • meric:

    Yes PR citizen , we are alredy suffering lots giving free way to quitters like sinha seeking shelters in my land, so “PR” remember calling us dogs will bring u nowhere, cz u are licking the dogs anus right in here, cz u have left your place seeking shelter here, so now that will answer who the real stray dog is, i have a home, unlike a roamin dog like u “PR CITIZEN”

  • meric:

    dogs are meant to be loyal, whether black dog, brown dog or
    yellow dog, they have to be loyal, if not loyal must be kicked out . Do not add new receipe to a well cooked dish, if u FT think yu are that great , use ur brain to develop ur own nation . Once again do not tray adding salt to a well cooked dish, then stating the salt played the major fraction of the dish, thats simply stupidity FTs

  • PR CITIZEN:

    How dare you scold us Meric??!!!! Haven’t you suffered enough at our hands??? We are here to save Singapore from the useless and lazy locals who demand to be paid high salaries while doing easy jobs.

    The government knows that Singaporeans are not up to market value and so they need us more to save Singapore. So they reward us well for saving singapore.

    Leaders like Sinha Sekhar is so vital to PAP’s talent pool and for the future of Singapore. We will surely support him while you ungrateful Singaporean dogs will try to set fire to poor innocent PAP MPs.

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  • patriot: @sensiblePR Don’t talk as if u know alot, asshole. Did u do NS???If not, please shut the...
  • Andrew Chuah is a retard: How about hanging your mother and father? Hang your bloody balls okay? Oops I...
  • Garrett: To: NumbersDon’tLieButYouDo Again, another PAP supporter twisting my words. The article was...
  • voter: HONG KAH GRC will fall to the Reform party in the next election
  • K: This Maththefucker finally admitted it is their own incompetency which caused the problem. In stark...
  • patriot: come on lah Mah!!U keep giving silly excuses!!If u are always caught off-guard, why do we need u...
  • Garrett: To: Stop complaining on the wrong issues Again, like Raynor you are twisting my words. Scrapping...
  • patriot: @CHN PR Veteran Please go back to yr communist country, smoke opium and DIE!!
  • Andrew Chuah is a retard: @ Andrew Chuah: September 3, 2010 at 6:17 pm You must be a retard to cherish...
  • BAH: This the biggest BS on earth. HDB couldn’t get rid of 35,000 flats because they never advertised...
  • Maign: BTW, A literal translation for 冰冻三尺非一日之寒 “Three feet of ice was not...
  • righteous: One saturday when the bus stopped @ Novena Church bus stop, was a daymare, my goodness! it took...
  • anonymous: SgIsHeavenUnderPAP: September 3, 2010 at 7:45 pm So there must be “holes” all over...
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