Dr Chee Soon Juan’s foreign liaisons: an act of patriotism or treachery?
Written by our Correspondent
Singapore opposition politician Dr Chee Soon Juan is not new to controversy and this time round he managed to get himself in the spotlight both at home and abroad again for a series of damning interviews he gave to U.S. radio stations castigating the Singapore government for its “political repression” on the eve of the APEC Summit held in Singapore.
Robert Amsterdam, a Canadian lawyer representing Dr Chee pro bono in his court cases, published an equally damaging White Paper calling on U.S. President Barack Obama to voice out his concerns about Singapore’s “human rights record” during his visit here which was widely publicized in the international media.’
The state media predictably published an article with a glaring headline “Canadian with links to Chee attacks Singapore’s political system” to portray Dr Chee as a “foreign stooge”, a label which he had found hard to shake off.
This is not the first time that Dr Chee had made used of the western media to attack the Singapore government.
In 1995, he staged a protest in Williams’ College where then Prime Minister Goh Chok Tong was to receive a Master’s degree from his alma mater.
Dr Chee’s “antics” was frowned about by Singaporeans who disapproved of him using “outsiders” to criticize their country’s leaders, which was reflected in subsequent elections in the declining share of votes received by his Singapore Democratic Party.
By and large, Dr Chee’s criticisms of Singapore in the west will hardly dent public confidence in the ruling party which maintains a tight grip on the Singapore media.
Neither will it have any impact on Singapore’s relationships with the United States and other countries. President Obama reaffirmed the excellent bilateral relations between Singapore and the United States during the APEC Summit. He did not meet Dr Chee or bring up Singapore’s “repressiveness” to its hosts.
Though Singapore is a tiny country, it has always been a key strategic ally of the United States in the region. Furthermore, its “repressiveness” pales in comparison to what is happening elsewhere in the region such as China, Vietnam and North Korea.
It will be foolhardy to expect the United States to strain diplomatic ties with Singapore by meddling in its domestic affairs.
Dr Chee may be able to generate bring attention to his cause, but its impact is likely to be minimal at least in the near future.
Not that his words doesn’t hurt the ruling party a bit. Singapore’s international image and standing have definitely taken a beating from the wave of negative publicity about its harsh and repressive laws to curtail the civil liberties of its citizens.
Branding is especially important for a small city-state like Singapore. What is the first impression that comes to one mind when Singapore is mentioned? Probably a nanny authoritarian state in contrast to Hong Kong which is widely viewed as a modern, cosmopolitan and liberal city though it is under communist rule.
One seldom hears the criticisms leveled at Singapore elsewhere – in Hong Kong, Taiwan, Japan or South Korea. Singapore can do without such persistent, if not irritating negative portrayal of its political system.
As for Dr Chee, the Singapore government can well afford to ignore him given that he is a spent force who posed little or no threat to them.
Being a bankrupt, Dr Chee is barred from contesting in future elections. His colleagues are unlikely to get elected either on a SDP ticket.
So is Dr Chee is a patriot or traitor?
Most Singaporeans certainly don’t regard him as a “patriot” trying to speak up for them.
To be fair to him, the mainstream media has been most biased towards him and is relatively successful in concocting an image of him of seeking out a personal vendetta against government leaders for bankrupting him.
To the ever faithful followers of the state media and the ruling party, Dr Chee is a traitor who will scoop to any means to defame the Singapore government.
But again, a traitor would have left Singapore a long time ago to fire pot shots at the ruling party from a safe distance afar rather than risk his livelihood and the future of his children by staying put in Singapore.
Dr Chee’s use of the foreign media to attack the Singapore government smacks more of desperation than a well-thought move. It is political suicide for any aspiring opposition politician who wishes to win a seat in parliament.
Besides Dr Chee, no other opposition leaders or MPs have criticized the Singapore government in the international press.
The ruling party has cleverly quoted them as examples that opposition politicians do exist in Singapore as long they don’t defame government leaders like Dr Chee in its defence.
Dr Chee is fighting a losing battle on his own without support even from his fellow opposition leaders or Singaporeans.
While he deserved some credit for his fighting spirit, doubts must be raised about his political acumen.
As history have shown us, the ruling party will not flinch from taking drastic actions to preserve its own interests despite international pressure, e.g. the arrests of 20 or so social workers and activists under “Operation Spectrum” in 1988.
Dr Chee and the SDP will be far better off building up their support at the grassroots level so that they will have a better chance of winning a coveted seat in the next general elections.
The Americans who heard Dr Chee’s interviews would probably have forgotten about Singapore and Dr Chee by now.
EDITORS’ NOTE:
Please sign up as a friend of our Facebook here
Loading ...
Anonymous on Sat, 21st Nov 2009 10:12 am
Chee: Stop the exploitation of workers (13 November 2009)
http://yoursdp.org/index.php/news/singapore/3063-chee-stop-the-exploitation-of-workers
Robox on Sat, 21st Nov 2009 10:20 am
Re: “So is Dr Chee is a patriot or traitor?…Most Singaporeans certainly don’t regard him as a “patriot” trying to speak up for them.”
True.
But if those ‘most Singaporeans’ care to take a good look at themselves, instead of looking for the next opportunity to point their fingers at anyone but themselves, they will find that it is ultimately their own fault that Singapore is in the situation it is in today.
Specifically, I am talking about the chronic lack of self-respect in Singaporeans. If Singaporeans actually had even a modicum of self respect, their reactions to the government’s abuses would have been very different from what it is today.
While it is of course true that this lack of self respect has been reinforced by the PAP government who will never pass up on ANY opportunity to exploit societal weaknesses that they see in Singaporeans and specifically the Chinese, it is also true that it takes two hands to clap: the hand of un-selfrespecting Singaporeans is the other hand that Singaporeans have given to the PAP to clap.
That’s why Dr Chee’s methods will not appeal to Singaporeans; they contain the underlying theme of self respect that Singaporeans don’t have in themselves and definitely don’t want in themselves and others around them.
His methods just don’t resonate with this group of Singaporeans.
Good luck at the next GE because you are going to get exactly the theoretical minimum of nine opposition MPs in the next Parliament; the theoretical minimum is also the maximum that the PAP intends, and it will be filled up by those in the opposition who are not very different from the PAP themselves.
Needless to say, you are going to get another 100% PAP Parliament the next time around.
Again.
Robox on Sat, 21st Nov 2009 10:21 am
Re: “The Americans who heard Dr Chee’s interviews would probably have forgotten about Singapore and Dr Chee by now.”
True. But that speaks more to Singapore’s unimportance to the rest of the world along with the US more than it does by any ‘incompetence’ on Dr Chee’s part that the writer is trying to insunuate.
Rufus Chu on Sat, 21st Nov 2009 11:10 am
Robox on Sat, 21st Nov 2009 10:20 am -
“they see in Singaporeans and specifically the Chinese,”
I beg your pardon. Maybe some sanity will descend upon you after you’ve watched this thought-provoking clipping like the rest –
http://www.razor.tv/site/servlet/segment/main/news/local/Newsplus/38982.html
fair and square on Sat, 21st Nov 2009 11:17 am
@Robox
i certainly agree with you!
just look at ageing pop stars,singers and others like TIGER WOODS and even ARONLD SWAZENEGAR(?)…If you remember,even the
haughty and mighty MM Lee paid attention to him and spoke highly of him when he wanted to run for PRESIDENT and OBAMA
was merely a “flash in a pan”?
How many of us,even if it appears inefficacious,would dare to do what DR chee is doing for singapore?
Most even “shiver” at the polling stations and so afraid to
buy them “HAMMER” during lunch-time from the late JB jeyaratnam?
Political SalesMaN on Sat, 21st Nov 2009 11:19 am
At this very time of crisis, the American don’t care about what U call Human Right or No right. Chee Compare to LKY.
LKY is in the lead.American now care who can pump Billion of Money into their Economic.Dr Chee this is not the right time to fool around. Now it up to the people of Singapore to solve this problem by themself, they are the one who give absolute power to this Dictator.
cy on Sat, 21st Nov 2009 11:25 am
CSJ is trying to enlist external forces to help him in his democratic quest, unfortunately the forces are too weak.
Many Singaporeans being conservative in nature will not be appealed by CSJ style. Why does CSJ persists in knocking against the wall as depicted by a previous cartoon in TR?
I read in SDP website that they are fighting the battle on all fronts, including the “exterior front”. But, with limited resources, isn’t it better to fight on only one front, the local scene.
If SDP’ purpose in fighting on the exterior front is to gain more money besides pushing for democracy, be careful of this dangerous game you are playing.
Anonymous on Sat, 21st Nov 2009 11:42 am
Singaporeans get all excited before and during the General Elections and that’s to be expected.
In fact, the PAP would like Singaporeans and the opposition to be contended with the once-in-5-years GE, plus the occasional noises here and there inside the Parliament.
Once the elections are over and the reality doesn’t change much, with the PAP is still the govt with the additional few opposition MPs and NCMPs, people will then begin to think of other possible approaches including Chee’s.
Anonymous on Sat, 21st Nov 2009 11:51 am
“Dr Chee’s “antics” was frowned about by Singaporeans who disapproved of him using “outsiders” to criticize their country’s leaders…”
This is always the line espoused by the PAP’s media to have Singaporeans believe in the negativity associated with CSJ.
Isn’t Your Correspondent doing the same by adding fire into such misconception and undermining the unpaid dedication and effort by a true patriot?
CSJ IS A CROOK! on Sat, 21st Nov 2009 12:03 pm
CSJ is 101% a traitor…he did not earned the respect of Singaporeans and had chosen to instead collude with foreign parties to run down Singapore…a highly despicable person with questionable character and crooked intentions!!
Because of his traitor acts, PAP has the opportunity to further create fear and run-down those credible opposition parties that are really trying hard to establish themselves as a credible alternative to PAP.
If a national vote was taken on whether CSJ is a traitor or not, I have no doubt that more than 90% of Singaporeans will not hesitant to call him a traitor, as he had clearly decided to achieve his own political ambition and personal agenda through colluding with foreign forces without considering the feelings of Singaporeans!!!!
I will spit at this traitor’s face if I do see him in Singapore, and will use him as an fine example to describe what it means to be a professional traitor!
CSJ is nothing but just a crook, and we do not need crook in our parliament!
Zone Trooper on Sat, 21st Nov 2009 12:06 pm
One must always be careful when seeking support through foreign liason. The hand that is handed out to help may turn around and smack you in the face.
Park Hee on Sat, 21st Nov 2009 12:21 pm
cy on Sat, 21st Nov 2009 11:25 am -
Sorry lah. Chee Bxx face loves fighting.
The merger with amicable Chiam didn’t last long. No sooner he starts quarreling with him.
I think his subject area psycho has go the better of him these days.
But surprising leh. He has funds ($$$) from don’-know-where after being sacked from his government job and paying his legal dues . . . . .
Fievel on Sat, 21st Nov 2009 12:52 pm
Im sorry to go off topic…but I’ve come to expect better grammar from Temasek Review…it’s just…a little annoying…
“This is not the first time that Dr Chee had made used of the western media to attack the Singapore government.”
>> made use
“Dr Chee’s “antics” was frowned about by Singaporeans who disapproved of him using “outsiders” to criticize their country’s leaders, which was reflected in subsequent elections in the declining share of votes received by his Singapore Democratic Party.”
>> frowned upon
Pei on Sat, 21st Nov 2009 12:52 pm
TR, I comment you for highlighting the possible repercussions and harms that CSJ is creating for the opposition movements in Singapore.
I agreed with you that CSJ is a controversy, and if he does not take a more strategic view of where he and his party is heading, and keep building their hopes through his constant collusion with foreign parties and givernment to run down Singapore, he is definitely digging his own (and SDP) grave.
It’s such a pity that he had decided to direct his passion and fire in the wrong way and with the wrong tactics. Personally, I would label him as a traitor as well.
Onn a separate note, I can see from the various articles that TR had published and highlighted, it is evident that TR is really working hard to act as a credible alternative media against the PAP controlled mainstream media in Singapore.
At least, you do not moderate and censor opposing views to the topic in concern, unlike TOC which is censoring opposing views that differs from theirs, especially when it concerns gays and LGBT rights!
Ii is a must for me to read TR everyday now in order to get another perspective of what I read in Shitty Times.
Congratulations and keep up the good work!
BryanT on Sat, 21st Nov 2009 1:00 pm
I don’t think that CSJ is a traitor in the traditional sense. He is not doing this for any foreign groups or organisations, even if he draws idealistic references therefrom.
He has resorted to the misplaced meander via a foreign line-of-attack because he has realised that his local tactics are ineffectual with moving the electorate. Such tactics have long been abandoned and abhorred by the other opposition parties.
The party has become a pariah of society through its idealogy that seeks to change society apart by tearing it apart first society. Singapore as a society may not be totally inclusive, but SDP has elected to excluded itself.
The only betrayal he has committed is to himself — unable to exploit his talents to productively contribute to himself and his family and by implication, to society.
Song on Sat, 21st Nov 2009 1:04 pm
There have never been any doubts in my mind that CSJ is a traitor, and a highly shameless one!
Imagine the kind of party SDP is, lead by a traitor who cares only for his own personal agenda in wanting to run down PAP (but in the process, run down Singapore as well).
He seems more interested in settling his own personal vendetta against PAP, and chose to ignore the overall feelings of Singaporeans.
Mavis on Sat, 21st Nov 2009 1:07 pm
In my conversation with my fellow u-mates, we had all branded CSJ as nothing but a traitor.
We find him a highly selfish and individualistic person who cares more of his own personal agenda than the overall agenda of the opposition movements in Singapore, and though we are supporters of the opposition parties, we had clearly draw a line between SDP and the rest.
CSJ, stop your stupidity and nonsense, would you!
BryanT on Sat, 21st Nov 2009 1:10 pm
sorry typo…
….idealogy that seeks to change society by tearing it apart first. Singapore as a society may not be totally inclusive, but SDP has elected to exclude itself.
Robox on Sat, 21st Nov 2009 1:12 pm
Re: “I read in SDP website that they are fighting the battle on all fronts, including the “exterior front”. But, with limited resources, isn’t it better to fight on only one front, the local scene.”
Which ‘local scene’ has enough people with self respect and would therefore be welcoming enough to the SDP that you would be recommending that as a strategy for the SDP?
YOU?
Your EQUALLY un-selfrespecting family, friends and colleagues?
Pray tell. Because your armchair criticism isn’t shedding ANY light on what the SDP’s next move should be given the low quality of humanity that Singaporeans are and that the SDP is fighting for.
Eng Hock on Sat, 21st Nov 2009 1:15 pm
CSJ is a crook!
CSJ is despicable!
CSJ is vindictive!
CSJ is selfish!
CSJ is shameless!
Above all, CSJ is a HIGHLY MOTIVATED TRAITOR!!
JUST4FUN on Sat, 21st Nov 2009 1:18 pm
Chee is a patriot or traitor,NO<NO, he is a pain in the ass of the PAP party. WHAT CAN HE DO, HE ONLY CAN IN AND OUT OF JAIL. ARE SINGAPOREAN really want a man without money and just only talk and talk, if he can get all the rich community to support him, maybe there is some hope of winning being a MP. Now he is happy with PAP, and he have work and earn himself a living. LIKE other country, if the government have this kind of people, they are sent away or put in the mental hospital. HE is nobody and like to show off only…..SINGAPOREAN still suffer ever CHEE are elects as MP also….MADE no different……
janetnt on Sat, 21st Nov 2009 1:57 pm
What can the foreign country do? Economic sanction? Trade Embargo or invade and install a colony? Just what do he expect his foreign stunt to achieve? To me he has cause more harm to the whole of Singapore then good which mark him as a traitor
Rufus Chu on Sat, 21st Nov 2009 2:34 pm
Robox on Sat, 21st Nov 2009 1:05 pm -
“Rufus” is my Christian (religion) name. “Chu” is my Chinese surname. I’m proud of both. God & heritage.
Btw, India’s Defence Minister is A.K. Antony.
Apparently only you’re the only one who can speak & think racism. Can’t blame you. A product of the Caste System (Varna)? In the blood I guess.
Race aside.
No point arguing. Time will tell. And it’d be anytime soon given the rat race in the world. I’ll place my bet on our MM whom many including foreign dignitaries have invited and pay to listen to for his take & his extrapolations.
Please lah – Not racial brother. Always think ECONOMICS! You don’t have to vote your cast you know in Singapore.
The great leader Deng Xiaoping says, “BLACK or WHITE cat is immaterial, so long as it catches MICE ($$$).” This is the Chinese catchphrase.
We’ll ALL see. Time will tell.
btan on Sat, 21st Nov 2009 3:02 pm
The only traitor is the PAP government importing foreigners to replace local citizens and giving them toilet paper citizenships so as to get more votes for their oppressive policies.
btan on Sat, 21st Nov 2009 3:06 pm
By the way, Aung San Suu Kyi also asked the western world to conduct trade embargoes on Burmese government. Does it make her a traitor to her country too?
Wake up on Sat, 21st Nov 2009 3:17 pm
For those who branded Chee as a traitor, do use some logic and common sense.
A traitor would sell his country for wealth and benefits. Name me ONE benefit Chee has taken from his cause.
All he got was being bankcrupt, arrested and inprisoned. Such is a man who would sacrifice so much just to push for his ideals to be known.
What are his ideals? For the ignorant, you better read their party page.
You got the media against him, the whole Singapore propaganda machine out to get him. Funny thing is, there is not even ONE letter nor sentence by him that are printed in the MSM, dispite pages and pages potraying him in a bad light.
Again and again, I have mentioned that in Singapore,
a murderer,
a rapist,
a drug trafficker,
HAVE a lawyer representation in Sg courts,
but Chee CANNOT find a lawyer to represent him.
this by itself speaks VOLUMES on what is against him, and the amount of propaganda that has filled into YOUR BRAIN to make you think that he’s a traitor or crook.
Did he really “shout” at GohCT during the election???
Did he really misuse funds that he got sacked by NUS???
What did he wrote in his newsletter that he got sued by PAP???
What?!?! You mean you didn’t even KNOW Chee’s side of story, and conveniently took in EVERYTHING according to the MSM, branding him as a traitor???
Man, you people not only need glasses for your eyes.
You need an extra pair for your mind, too.
Wake up on Sat, 21st Nov 2009 3:25 pm
You got people who need Superscale Salary so as to be enticed into politics.
You got people who not only forfeit his present (high) salary (as an NUS lecturer), but lost his flat, and spend time in prison so as to enforce what he believe as right for Singapore.
One needs money.
The other looses money.
One is passionless, so much so that people “throw chair” and “set them on fire”.
The other is passioned.
One is against the people’s Constitution rights by forbidding the “Assemble of ONE person”.
The other firmly believe in the Constitution right for all, rich and poor.
So in the end, ask your own conscience.
WHO is the BIGGER CROOK?
WHO is the BIGGER TRAITOR?
The answer is clear.
cy on Sat, 21st Nov 2009 3:51 pm
to robox,
i can understand your eagerness in defending CSJ. I respect him for his democratic ideal but i feel that he is going on the wrong path. time will prove him wrong.
and please do not insult the intelligence of singaporeans. respect others and you will be respected too.
Anonymous on Sat, 21st Nov 2009 3:58 pm
I see lots of diehard eager frogs croaking and sucking it up Pappies brand of sausages here – the usual Dr. Chee bashing. Or maybe I got it wrong, it is just venomous snakes hissing.
reader on Sat, 21st Nov 2009 4:19 pm
“he did not earned the respect of Singaporeans and had chosen to instead collude with foreign parties to run down Singapore”
“he had decided to direct his passion and fire in the wrong way and with the wrong tactics”
“He seems more interested in settling his own personal vendetta against PAP, and chose to ignore the overall feelings of Singaporeans”
“We find him a highly selfish and individualistic person who cares more of his own personal agenda than the overall agenda of the opposition movements”
I have read all the numerous comments above me labeling CSJ as a “despicable and shameless” traitor. Yet all I’m seeing are rhetoric and emotional arguments. Not a single one has provided LOGICAL and CONCRETE reasons exactly why CSJ’s foreign liaisons are harmful to Singaporeans.
What CSJ is doing now, is to attempt to raise international awareness of the curtailing of individual and political rights in Singapore. His idea is that with greater international awareness, there may come greater international pressure for the Lee govt to clean up their act. This strategy would be COMPLEMENTARY to pressure from within from raised awareness in our citizens.
Does that make him a traitor? Would we label Aung San Suu Kyi a traitor too because she has the backing of the American govt against the Burmese junta?
Is the tank man a traitor because his methods are more extreme than the rest of the Tiananmen protesters of that time? Do an opposition member’s views and methods have to be in line with the rest of the opposition in order to be labeled a true opposition?
So far, there has only been one LOGICAL argument, that CSJ may become prone to foreign influence if he managed to get into Parliament with foreign “assistance”. This will indeed be detrimental to Singapore.
But let’s remember that we are only talking about CSJ getting into parliament, not CSJ becoming a LHL-like PM with far-ranging powers. How much damage can one MP do?
People who are suggesting that Singapore will be “ruined” if CSJ ever gets voted in are simply playing up the irrational fears of other Singaporeans. CSJ is nowhere close to becoming the PM and forming a govt largely controlled by SDP. Such a nightmare scenario simply has no basis.
However, the benefits of voting in CSJ as a MP are real. We will get a vociferous MP who dares to question govt policies and speak up for the people. Sure, not all his views will be correct, but that is what a parliamentary debate is for – To hear and evaluate views from all perspectives.
tookie on Sat, 21st Nov 2009 5:42 pm
@Robox, I suppose you must be the only person in Singapore with self-respect. Could you please elaborate on how you are using your enlightenment in ways that can be considered self-respecting? Or are you just sitting like a coward behind a computer screen? Somehow, you have given yourself the authority to define what is self-respect according to some ridiculously narrow standards and you are condemning all us stupid Singaporeans. Wake up. People don’t make irrational choices. Just because you happen to disagree with them doesn’t make them stupid. You have no self-respect, because you have done yourself a disservice by limiting yourself to such narrow and myopic views, and you don’t respect anyone else by condemning their choices without even a proper understanding of how the world works or how people think.
tookie on Sat, 21st Nov 2009 5:48 pm
I don’t think CSJ is a traitor, but he is definitely not an intelligent politician, and is driven by a huge ego and personal agenda. Perhaps he is self-deluded. He has not succeeded in even getting a proportion of support worth talking about, and yet he has crowned himself the opposition king of Singapore. WIthout legitimacy of any kind at home, he assumes that he can move greater mountains abroad. I agree, the government really should just leave him alone because he is far too radical and ridiculous for the populace here. He will never get very far, neither will the SDP unless they shake of their radical image. They have done the opposition a disservice by creating factions and disunity amongst (and previously, within) the parties, at a time where we need opposition parties to be more cohesive. Beating him down further will just give him more publicity and embarrass us even further. Given that he is supposed to be bankrupt, how is it that he can travel to the states for these interviews? Who is funding him, and should we be wary of these sources?
Confused Singaporeans on Sat, 21st Nov 2009 6:04 pm
its so funny reading the comments that are largely crying out that Dr.Chee is a traitor.
these loud voices look at a man who is bringing to light to the world the abuses of the regime. how is that being a traitor. the Singapore Chinese community should quit its “cannot loose face” attitude. thats essentially why all the singapore chinese critics above are angry at Chee. they feel they are loosing face in the global stage. everywhere i go, people who know singapore speak very lowly about everything except its efficiency. even if they were to sing praises in the open, when they go off the record, they are full of mockery. so you dont need Chee to make you look stupid in the world. the world already does not think highly of this country.
its so funny to see these chinamen being totally oblivious to the treacherous policies, actions and decisions of PAP and their runners.
its hilarious to see how they will vocally announce Dr. Chee as a traitor for going international to expose the abuses in Singapore AND NOT
1) LKY who worked with the Japanese as a translator who were systematically targeting chinese and killing them during WWII
2) PAP leaders including LKY who wiped out dialects which is the core of singapore chinese heritage
3) PAP politicians, government policy makers who think welfare is a dirty word and have failed to use the wealth of the country to look after the unfortunate
4) PAP politicians and government policy makers who rather use all the wealth of this nation to invest in stocks, shares, companies than to allocate some to alleviate the suffering of the people
5) PAP politicians who attracted foriegn MNCs and achieved economic growth during the earlier decades using cheap labour and who later turn their backs on these labour when they grow old
the list goes on
Karmic Horlando on Sat, 21st Nov 2009 7:15 pm
USA relies on the inc to invest in them.
antipap on Sat, 21st Nov 2009 7:23 pm
ah come on, Old fart uses foreigners all the time.
why can’t Chee ? fair and square , what he can do so can Chee.
and since when is it that HK didn’t criticize old fart ?
what about that time they booed and hissed him when he took some honourary award?
I am very sure HKers do not like top down dictatorial wannabes , they never have and never will.
Chee is on the right track – he got nothing to lose and he should go to Alex Jones etc , he’ll get more mileage there .
antipap on Sat, 21st Nov 2009 7:36 pm
oh no not that Botox character again.
He used to be on sammyboy and if we are not careful, he’s going to turn this into another ” I’m-an-Indian-victim ” rant.
Ignore he has nothing useful to say
Brendan on Sat, 21st Nov 2009 8:13 pm
cy on Sat, 21st Nov 2009 11:25 am
“But, with limited resources, isn’t it better to fight on only one front, the local scene.”
I concur with you!!
Where on the hell on earth was CSJ during the APEC when Obama was hare? Supposely out of Sg?
It would have been better if he took to the streets and embarassed the PAP on Sg soil. Unfortunately neither did amny of the members did. Maybe I suppose the Crimewatch video scared the sh*t of the SDP????
Sanjay on Sat, 21st Nov 2009 8:31 pm
To Robox on Sat, 21st Nov 2009 1:05 pm -
“camels on his way from the Bombay airport to his hotel in a part of India where there are absolutely NO camels”
Apparently you haven’t been to Mumbai. Your outburst is uncalled for. Your Minister Mentor is indeed a very observant man. I can assure you there are camels along the wayside, trudging now and then, from the airport towards the city outskirts.
Check out the Rajasthan Camel Tour, Rajasthan Camel Safari Packages, etc., if you were going to Mumbai.
Anonymous on Sat, 21st Nov 2009 8:56 pm
Evils hide in darkness fearing the light of truth. CSJ is a lighted candle. THAT IS WHY his political opponents have long clearly decided that HE MUST BE DECIMATED POLITICALLY.
The forces of darkness hate and fearful him without admitting publicly of course – investing in enormous energy and creativity of inventing inscrutable ways and to ridiculous extent of “fixing” him to prevent him from getting into Parliament.
Inside there, evil forces know CSJ’s lack of timidity and sharpness will bring God’s fear into those who failed their public duty and justice to society. They know the house of cards and games show will crumble so fast. They won’t let Chee make it happen, trust me!
With grim determination and quiet support, however, Chee knows it is only a matter of time he will get in there. Singaporeans are not blind of strange happenings around for too long and insupportable of truth and justice.
Papa of Singapore on Sat, 21st Nov 2009 9:09 pm
In politics one cannot be too predictable.
Going on the streets to protest illegally will again result in arrest and charge, and detention in Queenstown Remand Prison. That is a fruitless endeavour. Why continue to knock one’s head against a solid rock?
Change tactics. CSJ has changed his tactics.
Indianmen on Sat, 21st Nov 2009 9:09 pm
#Confused Singaporeans, how did you come to the conclusion that those who opposed CSJ are chinamen…you are a racist, quite obviously…shoo shoo…go somewhere else would you?
In case you’re still wondering, I’m an Indian (local breed) and I don’t like Chee Soon Juan’s erratic and irrational character a single bit at all!
Seriously on Sat, 21st Nov 2009 9:37 pm
SDP only needs to get just one member into the next Parliament and all those fictional devilish caricatures invented over the decades to portray them will be demolished forever. It will open the door for true opposition politics.
Singaporeans who want change must help them to open the first door.
Blind Leading The Blind on Sat, 21st Nov 2009 9:41 pm
Anonymous on Sat, 21st Nov 2009 8:56 pm
“Evils hide in darkness fearing the light of truth. CSJ is a lighted candle.”
True, CSJ is a lighted candle still burning because of foreign support and money! He has to continue to assume his role as a foreign stooge in order to continue lighting the candle. However, as the candle is burning in bright daylight, no one will ever see it as as relevant and it will not serve any purposes at all, besides hurting those who are close to the naked flame produced by the candle.
“With grim determination and quiet support, however, Chee knows it is only a matter of time he will get in there. Singaporeans are not blind of strange happenings around for too long and insupportable of truth and justice.”
Not sure whether you can call that grim determination, but it certainly looks to me more like grim insanity and stupidity, and filled with personal grudges.
By the look of it, in whichever and whatever ways, he will never ever step into Singapore’s parliament, precisely because Singaporeans are not blinded, as Singaporeans will not be fooled by his irrelevant actions and erractic tactics.
It looks more like he is the one who is blinded!
Seriously on Sat, 21st Nov 2009 9:50 pm
Indianmen on Sat, 21st Nov 2009 9:09 pm
Confused Singaporean did not say YOU are a Chinamen. Neither did he speculated that you might be an “Indiamen” born here or arrived from Uganda, perhaps, in Africa.
How could you NOT be irratic and irrational of behaviour to accuse Confused Singaporean of racism?
A reference to cultural traits of those Confused Singaporean spoke to is NOT an attribution of racism which can only exist in YOUR mind of unsolicited confession of such unhealthy thoughts here.
Anonymous on Sat, 21st Nov 2009 10:39 pm
@ Blind Leading The Blind on Sat, 21st Nov 2009 9:41 pm
Yes, you are indeed blind trying very hard to lead the blind even believing in psychic prediction of self-delusion.
What more can I say?
Emotional? Such hyperbole like…”grim insanity and stupidity, and filled with personal grudges”. I have seen any of these fictions since outside Singapore no one has uttered such flamboyance. Suspect of emotional resides in you? You know the truth of this point.
And such prediction…”he will never ever step into Singapore’s parliament..” Maybe you can tell us all here how much you pay your clairvoyant “master” on the backlane of Khiong Siak streets in Chinatown? Was it $2 for this prediction or 2 cents only.
But I guess your clairvoyant master is probably living in poverty of his unappreciated psychic skills (except by you of course). Hope this clairvoyant of yours live a wealthier life than those aged collectors of discarded card boxes for a living.
I have seen many such psychic clairvoyants on the street sides but never thought worthy of throwing my $2 for such naive charity.
I prefer the world of reality – not psychic emotionally drivel of self-delusion. So you must understand, we are definitely DIFFERENT!
Indianmen on Sat, 21st Nov 2009 10:42 pm
Seriously on Sat, 21st Nov 2009 9:50 pm
You must be either seriously blind or simply having a mental block not to notice what Confused Singaporean had written (or are you Confused Singaporean” yourself).
Have you not read the sentence “the Singapore Chinese community should quit its “cannot loose face” attitude. thats essentially why all the singapore chinese critics above are angry at Chee.”
Did you not also read the sentence “its so funny to see these chinamen being totally oblivious to the treacherous policies, actions and decisions of PAP and their runners. ”
Surely, only a racist can write such kind of stuff! And it is strange that you did not detect such obvious traits in his posting.
Anyway, I was pointing out to Confused Singaporeans that he seems bent on accusing those who oppose CSJ are chinamen, and I want him to know that I am an Indian, and I do not like CSJ either…period. If you still can’t understand such a simple statement, then you probably have low IQ, and that’s something nobody can help you much with, unfortunately!
Talking about unhealthy thoughts, I think you have not only truly manifested your own unhealthy thoughts, but also, you looks like a racist yourself too from your tone and use of words (I still think you are Confused Singaporean yourself)!
Shoo Shoo…
Indianmen on Sat, 21st Nov 2009 10:55 pm
By the way, Seriously, SDP did have 3 party members elected into the parliament in 1991, but it was Chee Soon Juan who had caused them to lose their seats in the following elections, through his betrayal and a calculated ousting of Chiam See Tong from the very SDP he had founded…just in case you don’t have the IQ to dig out any historical facts!
janetnt on Sat, 21st Nov 2009 11:11 pm
I think there is too much Chee story in TR already, it only serve to drive up the ‘readership’ and comment.
Can we have something elsE?
Ah Siao on Sat, 21st Nov 2009 11:14 pm
To those of you accussing CSJ taking money from foreigners:
How come the omnipresent PAP have not revealed it on the states propaganda? I am sure if that is true, it would be one of the best weapon to attack him.
Wake up on Sat, 21st Nov 2009 11:39 pm
Indian man is totally wrong.
“By the way, Seriously, SDP did have 3 party members elected into the parliament in 1991, but it was Chee Soon Juan who had caused them to lose their seats in the following elections, through his betrayal and a calculated ousting of Chiam See Tong from the very SDP he had founded…just in case you don’t have the IQ to dig out any historical facts!”
Did you ask the actual persons involved, namely Chiam See Tong and Chee, or read their version of the actual event,
OR
Did you trumpet this LIE by the Straits Times without checking out the REAL facts yourself, Indianman? The one without IQ is you yourself. Totally suckered by the MSM.
Wake up on Sun, 22nd Nov 2009 12:02 am
I agree with “reader” posted on Sat, 21st Nov 2009 4:19 pm.
There are so many people throwing emotional accusations WITHOUT CONCRETE EVIDENCE against one man who cannot even get his say printed by MSM.
MSM accused him of “shouting at GCT” during the early election. What is Chee’s reply? Censored.
MSM accused him of mis-using NUS funds and got sacked. What is Chee’s reply? Censored.
MSM accused him of being a “traitor” to Sg. What is Chee’s reply? Censored.
Some forumers accused him of using foreign funds. There are also forumers who disagree with his actions stating that other opposition has done a better job.
What a joke.
Chee knew long ago that doing what the rest of the opposition is currently doing now is USELESS when the regime set up laws AGAINST the constitutional Laws for their own benefit.
Isn’t it EASY for Chee to play along like the rest of the useless opposition, get a seat in the powerless wayang parliment and get paid $10,000/mth???
Why did the Neurology Lecturer sacrifice everything and choose to fight for what he believe as RIGHT for Singaporeans???
Dr Lim got IMPRISONED WITHOUT TRAIL for more than 20 years.
Before any of you continue to throw baseless accussations onto these men, read and hear their side of the story BEFORE drawing a conclusion.
Only then, will the TRUTH come to LIGHT.
Seriously on Sun, 22nd Nov 2009 12:10 am
@ Indianmen on Sat, 21st Nov 2009 10:42 pm
@ Indianmen on Sat, 21st Nov 2009 10:55 pm
Ha ha, you are as much of being very funny and ambivalence of thinking here. You are “Indiamen” ( your declaration) amd Confused Singapore spoke a little less flattery of Chinese culture – irrelevant to you as “Indiamen” and your little tail seems to have got stepped upon to fuel your fire in your head of an emotional rebuttal.
That says everything about your displaced and misguided thoughts on racism of your imagined INEXPLICABLE ENLARGED relevance to the subject matter of this thread. If Confused Singaporean had discomforting words appertaining to “Indiamen” ethnicity, it would have given you the fatest of opportunity to construct Mount Everests out of a molehill on Changi beach. But I shall allow you a margin for freakish perversion of irascible thoughts.
I am Chinese. It still did not bother me what Confused Singaporean or you spoke of my cultural traits. If Confused Singaporean uttered the same words into my left ear, it would have passed on like wind breezing my right ear and disappeared into the emptiness of nothing.
Your question asked ..”or are you Confused Singaporean” yourself.” left me a good beautiful choice. I could tell you the truth that I am not Confused Singaporean or I could be nasty and tell you to ask Confused Singaporean to confirm or deny and this poster might just find it convenient of opportunity to rub it in of your stupidity to even ask.
But I be nice and said honestly and emphatically NO. It is not extremely intelligent of you NOT to have noticed that I did NOT repeat any of his/her thoughts nor did I defend those thoughts as relevantly suitable of this thread. It was to me – transparent of racism accusation of yours and nothing else. You claimed wisdom of observations of someone’s writing compared to me but the evidence here of your writing disproves your self-delusion of imagined keenness of mind.
Your concluding remark…”you looks like a racist yourself too from your tone and use of words (I still think you are Confused Singaporean yourself)!” is far far far too hilarious for my enjoyment of read.
I was just humouring you in good taste. I used your words of import – Indiamen – but to good effects and good intent because history will show a lot of VERY RICH AND VERY SUCCESSFUL INDIAN ORIGIN businessmen fled Uganda when crazy dictator Idi Amin came into power causing political turmoil and economic collapse. Again, your racism found in your mind rear an ugly head!!
And finally your history lesson on CSJ involvement in SDP with others in opposition rank is old story. There are far more exciting games show I have seen of very long local politics and history, so your little insignificant kindergarten lesson does not impress me one bit – never mind my IQ which we both are certain is a lot less ambivalent compared to what you have demonstrated here.
fpc on Sun, 22nd Nov 2009 12:42 am
//Mavis
Did CSJ get any directorship in a foreign bank or MNC?
Did CSJ lose or make money out of the political struggles he went through?
Did CSJ predictions about mishandling of GIC/TH monies come true?
Why is he a traitor when he got nothing out of the whole process?
Why is he selfish? He got nothing out of the whole ordeal that started in 1993.
Robox on Sun, 22nd Nov 2009 12:51 am
To Stupid Sanjay on Sat, 21st Nov 2009 8:31 pm:
Re: “Check out the Rajasthan Camel Tour, Rajasthan Camel Safari Packages, etc., if you were going to Mumbai.”
Oh, so Rajasthan and Maharashtra are now the same states, are they, separated as they by hundreds of kilometres from each other?
It is obviously YOU who needs a geography lesson, and much much more self respect so that you will not fall for more of Lee Kuan Yew’s LIES!
janetnt on Sun, 22nd Nov 2009 1:06 am
Maybe he is obsessive or mad? Osama also gave up alot for his idea?
Robox on Sun, 22nd Nov 2009 1:17 am
To Indianmen on Sat, 21st Nov 2009 10:42 pm:
Re: “I was pointing out to Confused Singaporeans that he seems bent on accusing those who oppose CSJ are chinamen, and I want him to know that I am an Indian, and I do not like CSJ either…period.”
If it’s indeed true that you are Indian, then maybe you should consider these facts:
1. You are an Indian Confucianazi, a monster created by Lee Kuan Yew; your ideological counterparts would be other Indian Confucianazis like Kishore Mahbubani and Kangaroo Shamugam, supposedly the law minister and a lawyer by training but doesn’t the know the law one bit like his Chinese law-trained mentor Lee Kuan Yew.
2. You have been acculturated – poisoned – by the larger unselfrespecting Chinese population, so that they can now shower you with accolades and proclaim you to be a “good Indian”; you would have to simultaneously lose your self respect and are now sucking up to them for your economic and financial survival. And your fragile ego – that’s what the Chinese have in place of self respect.
At any rate, Confused Singaporeanis is very definitely spot on: it is the chronic Chinese affliction of *never being seen to lose face* that is at the ROOT of the hostility towards Dr Chee, his message and his methods; the lack of self respect is culturally Chinese in origin.
Live in ANY other country – I don’t mean China – for a substantial amount of time, and you will find that self respect comes intuitively for any other human population. But it is hard to come by in Singapore and it is ENTIRELY due to Chinese culture.
Still, I FULLY EXPECT that you will be exactly like the Chinese: you will be absolutely delighted the day Singapore finally has the full range of human rights, seize EVERY opportunity to exercise your rights, but ironically will continue to crow about Singaporean exceptionalism for something fought for by people you currently despise.
That’s how subhuman you are. But it’s not surprising in the Chinese dominated cultural environment in Singapore, whether you are Indian or not.
There is proof for what I’m saying. There are thousands of anti-rights Singaporeans who have migrated to Western countries, and guess what?
THEY ARE NOT COMPLAINING ABOUT THE GREATER HUMAN DIGNITY THAT THEY LIVE WITH THERE!
milo tarek on Sun, 22nd Nov 2009 1:19 am
Yeehah! This thread is the most excellent proof that Dr. Chee and the SDP have got their strategy right. Look at all the usual suspects falling over themselves to hurl abuse at him – the stench of their rage and desperation is almost palpable!
‘Traitor’ seems to be the favourite epithet because he has the clout to gain the respect of an international audience. Haha, in that case I suppose LKY must also be a traitor par excellence since he never passes up the opportunity to be interviewed by foreign press and name-drop the VIP Westerner he just spoke to. Did he open his ancient yap for a grovelling local journalist on Razor TV for the APEC dialogue? Nah, had to be the angmoh editor of TIME Magazine, didn’t it? Buys the vague and long-winded gas-bag a little bit more credibility.
The writer of this article is pretty upset that the government’s carefully stage-managed APEC dog-and-pony show (which was designed to bathe PAP in golden light) received a double-slap in the nuts with the surprise release of Amsterdam’s White Paper followed by Dr. Chee’s sudden appearance on US radio. Oh, the lovely squeals of outrage! No need for futile fist-waving at Hong Lim to redden the face of the tin-pot tyrant and his Public Order Act.
It seems that Chee is smart enough not to play by the illegal rules written by the abusers of the Constitution. Now there’s a surprise. Way to go, SDP! The level of screams, inane abuse, puerile insults and threats is a barometer of your success at telling the people the truth about Singapore PRC Inc. If the dogs aren’t howling your tactics aren’t working.
Robox on Sun, 22nd Nov 2009 1:31 am
To Wake up on Sat, 21st Nov 2009 11:39 pm:
You are right. And Indianmen is definitely wrong.
But what else can you expect from an unselfrespecting someone who learns political analysis from the Straits Times?
The reason that there were 3 SDP MPs (under Mousey Tong) once had entirely to do with the success of the PAP’s kill-the-JBJ-chicken-to-frighten-the-opposition-and-PAP-voting-monkeys. The Frightened Monkeys did not dare vote for the WP (then) because they feared that any association with JBJ would incriminate them. So they voted the SDP instead.
That’s how unself respecting the Frightened Monkeys, even those who would normally vote for the opposition, are.
Then, when the PAP gangsters got JBJ out of Parliament, the logical next step was to start the killing of the next most vocal chicken: Chee Soon Juan.
This continues till today.
And the Frightened Monkeys responded as predictably as Lee Luan Yew knew they would.
So what has not having SDP MPs (led by Chee Soon Juan) in Parliament have to do with Chee Soon Juan himself, when it is entirely the Frightened Monkey behaviour – a true testament of the chronic lack of self respect – that led to those electoral results?
That’s the depth of Indianmen’s pseudo-analysis of politics.
Robox on Sun, 22nd Nov 2009 1:36 am
cy on Sat, 21st Nov 2009 3:51 pm
Re: “…to robox…respect others and you will be respected too.”
Thank you but I have absolutely NO NEED FOR RESPECT from those who are unselfrespecting. Why would I want to demean myself so.
Instead, I suggest that YOU start having some self respect, and respect for you by others will naturally follow.
To tookie on Sat, 21st Nov 2009 5:42 pm:
Re: “Robox, I suppose you must be the only person in Singapore with self-respect.”
Yes.
Any problem with that?
Effortlessly.
Bruce W on Sun, 22nd Nov 2009 2:17 am
For those of you who condemn CSJ, I was once like you.
I believed in everything the media says about him.
Anyway many years back when internet is only at his infancy, what else can I read but the local media?
Now you have the internet, you can read BOTH side of the stories (PAP vs CSJ).
Do your homework first, and I’ll not be surprised that you’ll turn around to admire, salute and support him.
Exposer on Sun, 22nd Nov 2009 3:32 am
I am once like Bruce W too, believing the lies of PAP and propaganda thinking that PAP deserves the ruling party due to the progressive media of the PAP’s mouthpiece ShittyTimes. But once internet and blog becomes pervasive, and due wider exposure through travelling, I discover of been a fool all that time, and now the truth is unraveled that LKY and his family of stooges are nothing but mediocre performer ruling for their own self-interest above citizen’s need. Why Singaporeans choose to continue in those nonsense of PAP again ? How many times they are going to slap by PAP before they wake their idea ?
Ha Ha Ha... on Sun, 22nd Nov 2009 6:17 am
Ha Ha Ha…
Some observations made after reading all the postings:
1) Those who do not support CSJ are automatically branded as PAP stooge or supporters. Really? Are there no other opposition parties in Singapore?
2) Those who do not support CSJ are also naturally assumed to be biased and influenced by MSM. Really? So can we also assume those who support CSJ and SDP were biased and influenced by their reports and articles as well?
3) There are some individuals with low self esteem and in order to get some “respects” from others, needs to show their omnipresence in different forums to attack everything and anything so as to demand attention. Do these people really have any self-respect, or to them, attacking others is the only way to show they have self-respect? In fact, these people (pro or anti CSJ) are showing the same traits and behaviors like the erractic and obnoxious CSJ!
Wise minds think alike, but fools seldom differ as well!
Anyway, what is there to argue? Just let the next election results show who are those with low IQ, who are those with high IQ, but not forgetting too, who are those with no IQ at all!
Ha Ha Ha…
Fearful of ghosts on Sun, 22nd Nov 2009 8:45 am
janetnt on Sat, 21st Nov 2009 11:11 pm
I think there is too much Chee story in TR already, it only serve to drive up the ‘readership’ and comment.
Can we have something elsE?
DID YOU GOT SATURDAY NIGHT FEVER? You came back with this strangely re-discovered peurile sh@t with a predictable vengeance
@janetnt on Sun, 22nd Nov 2009 1:06 am
Maybe he is obsessive or mad? Osama also gave up alot for his idea?
ARE YOU OBSSESSIVE OR MAD OR BOTH? Or was it your ghost that came back to haunt this thread?
Please tell us!
BryanT on Sun, 22nd Nov 2009 9:40 am
@Bruce W on Sun, 22nd Nov 2009 2:17 am
“Do your homework first, and I’ll not be surprised that you’ll turn around to admire, salute and support him.”
Many of us have done our homework — read what he has had to say (on SDP’s website), read about what he and his coterie of followers has done (on SDP’s website), and tried to understand the rationale of what he is trying to do. We are left unconvinced that he is worth admiring, saluting, and god-forbid, supporting.
Instead, his are an ego worth deflating, objectives worth shunning, and antics worth ignoring.
BryanT on Sun, 22nd Nov 2009 10:16 am
@Wake up on Sun, 22nd Nov 2009 12:02 am
“MSM accused him of “shouting at GCT” during the early election. What is Chee’s reply? Censored. MSM accused him of mis-using NUS funds and got sacked. What is Chee’s reply? Censored. MSM accused him of being a “traitor” to Sg. What is Chee’s reply? Censored.”
You may be surprised, but the champion of freedom-of-expression religiously censors comments to his website. Comments that debunks his words and actions are often disallowed because they reveal inconvenient truths about his party, strategy and underlying intents.
Of course, he welcomes sycophantic comments with open arms…. try it.
Robox on Sun, 22nd Nov 2009 12:33 pm
Don’t listen to this BryanT shit.
He’s someone who thinks that he has every right to abuse the freedom of speech on the SDP website with his harassment.
From the other corner of his toxic mouth, he dares allege – with absolutely no proof – that Dr Chee and the SDP are fighting for unfettered rights: the same unfettered rights to abuse free speech for himself that he will deny.
But that’s the mental illness of the PAP camp for you.
Robox on Sun, 22nd Nov 2009 12:43 pm
To Ha Ha Ha… on Sun, 22nd Nov 2009 6:17 am;
Yes, Ha Ha Ha to you too.
Re: “Those who do not support CSJ are automatically branded as PAP stooge or supporters.”
Show me where on this thread that your assertion is true. On the other hand, don’t you think that those who give agency to Lee Kuan Yew’s unschooled views SHOULD be ‘branded as PAP stooge or supporters’?
Re: “Are there no other opposition parties in Singapore?”
If you are talking about the Workers Party and the one-man party that has never grown despite being in Parliament for a quarter century, Mousey Tong, the answer is “No”. there are no other opposition parties: the WP and Mousey Tong are the mirror image of PAP in the opposition camp.
Re: “Those who do not support CSJ are also naturally assumed to be biased and influenced by MSM….So can we also assume those who support CSJ and SDP were biased and influenced by their reports and articles as well?”
No.
Those who support Dr Chee and the SDP have two points of view: the MSM one and the SDP one; they are exposed to both and decided for themselves which is the correct version of the truth.
Not true for those who only read the MSM. Like you.
Anonymous on Sun, 22nd Nov 2009 1:11 pm
@BryanT on Sun, 22nd Nov 2009 10:16 am
Of course, he welcomes sycophantic comments with open arms?
WOW, are you sure you haven’t got severe brain damage afflicted with delusional sycophantic thoughts?.
I checked Cambridge Online dictionary on the highfaluting word “sycophantic”
http://dictionary.cambridge.org/
It means….”of a person or of behaviour) praising people in authority in a way that is not sincere, usually in order to get some advantage from them”
You elevated CSJ to be our next Prime Minister!!. Your wish may be fulfilled!
Anonymous on Sun, 22nd Nov 2009 1:13 pm
BryanT on Sun, 22nd Nov 2009 10:16 am
Of course, he welcomes sycophantic comments with open arms?
WOW, are you sure you haven’t got severe brain damage afflicted with delusional sycophantic thoughts?.
I checked Cambridge Online dictionary on the highfaluting word “sycophantic”
http://dictionary.cambridge.org/
It means….”of a person or of behaviour) praising people in authority in a way that is not sincere, usually in order to get some advantage from them”
You elevated CSJ to be our next Prime Minister!!. Your wish may be fulfilled!
admin on Sun, 22nd Nov 2009 1:40 pm
Hi all,
Please keep to the topic of discussion and refrain from posting any inflammatory racist remarks. They will be deleted immediately.
pio on Mon, 23rd Nov 2009 1:40 am
CSJ is on the right side of history and time will prove his worth.
Gajananvihari on Mon, 23rd Nov 2009 11:49 am
CSJ is on the wrong side of history and time will prove his supporters that his eccentric, irrational and erratic behaviors are disrupting and causing great setback to the opposition movements in Singapore!
Time will also tell that a traitor will come to no good end!
Repent and start anew, and CSJ may have a better chance of seeing himself in the parliament as a credible opposition!
Singaporeans are not blinded to PAP bullying tactics, neither are they blinded to CSJ’s treacherous acts of running down Singapore for his own personal agenda and gains!
Change must come on Mon, 23rd Nov 2009 12:28 pm
Gajananvihari on Mon, 23rd Nov 2009 11:49 am
…eccentric, irrational and erratic behaviors…CSJ????
http://www.artofwar.net/china/quotes.htm
Sun Tzu art of war quotes says
In conflict, straightforward actions generally lead to engagement, surprising actions generally lead to victory
LeeLL on Mon, 23rd Nov 2009 12:40 pm
Whenever Chee’s name is mentioned, the PAP internet
brigade would come out with knives and guns to hammer
him down.
I wonder why they didn’t do this to Chiam or LTK, when
they actually achieved nothing substantial since entering
Parliament?
Maybe its they are their Masters’ approved oppositon?
y
Potong Pasir Resident on Mon, 23rd Nov 2009 1:10 pm
LeeLL on Mon, 23rd Nov 2009 12:40 pm wrote – “I wonder why they didn’t do this to Chiam or LTK, when they actually achieved nothing substantial since entering
Parliament?”
I wonder how ignorant people can get with such statements!
Whose perspective are you using to judge both Chiam and LTK or not achieving anything…your own ignorant perspectives, or the perspective of Potong Pasir or Hougang’s residents?
Are you implying that residents of Hougang and Potong Pasir are blinded and stupid to have elected the same opposition MP elections after elections?
If they have not achieved anything, would the residents still vote them in despite the grand and tempting vote-buying upgrading tactics of PAP?
Many Singaporeans do not know what they have achieved because we have a PAP controlled media, but no reporting does not means that they did not achieve anything. Ask the residents or Hougang nd Potong Pasir and see how they fondly praised their MP for their work done, before you make such sweeping statements!
The same way you point your fingers at PAP internet brigade, it is also evident that we are now seeing more and more of SDP’s mindless and senseless internet brigade out to stir shit in the same way the erratic CSJ is stirring shit through colluding with foreign forces.
wakingup on Mon, 23rd Nov 2009 2:56 pm
“RE SINGAPOREAN really want a man without money and just only talk and talk, if he can get all the rich community to support him, maybe there is some hope of winning being a MP.”
Yeah… Should have gotten rid of Nelson Mandela… spend too much time in jail….
When a man is devoid of all things bar his mouth, he can only use his mouth.
So working for Japs is ok, and talking to US media is bad bad bad? And when u talk good to the media, that’s ok and if you talk bad to the media it become bad?
At least he can die a man of dignity, even if you don’t believe in the things he says…
wakingup on Mon, 23rd Nov 2009 2:59 pm
many years from now a child will ask his parents… when I grow up I want to be the most powerful person in the nation…
mother looks kindly into the eyes of the boy and ask, so you want to become the president?
the boy reply, no i want to be the senior mentor to the senior ministers….
BryanT on Mon, 23rd Nov 2009 3:28 pm
@LeeLL on Mon, 23rd Nov 2009 12:40 pm
“I wonder why they didn’t do this to Chiam or LTK, when
they actually achieved nothing substantial since entering
Parliament?”
Through their appeal to reason and common sense, CST and LTK have gained the respect of many Singaporeans, including who probably did not vote for them. Parliament works by having MPs (whether from the ruling party or opposition) speak up on issues that affect the people. By giving voice to the concerns of the people, they are tacitly affecting decision making. This impact is real even if not directly apparent.
In contrast, CSJ shoots from the hip, and resorts to tactics that exploit the emotional vulnerabilities of the populace. His strategy is brash and through portraying himself as a victim of the system. The ideals he purportedly pursues are the utopian intangibles that are easy to promise. Nothing more.
Impact in parliament is not equivalent to raising a ruckus, ala JBJ. We do not need a successor to JBJ in the august house, least of all CSJ.
It is not the PAP IB out with the “knives and guns”, but rather CSJ swinging his placards and strident clamour for attention that stirs the people against him.
Fearful of ghosts on Mon, 23rd Nov 2009 3:28 pm
Potong Pasir Resident on Mon, 23rd Nov 2009 1:10 pm
…more and more of SDP’s mindless and senseless internet brigade out to stir shit…???
Where?? I don’t see any on any TR.
It is either your thallium joke! Or are you one of the dead man from the deceased Pappies brigade talking from your graveyard?.
Potong Pasir Resident on Mon, 23rd Nov 2009 4:49 pm
Fearful of ghosts on Mon, 23rd Nov 2009 3:28 pm
“Where?? I don’t see any on any TR.”
…just look into a mirror, it is just right in front of you!
“It is either your thallium joke! Or are you one of the dead man from the deceased Pappies brigade talking from your graveyard?.”
…see, I told you so, SDP IB like yourself is simply erratic, mindless and senseless! Anyway and anyhow, CSJ and SDP had already started to dig their own graveyard!
yus on Mon, 23rd Nov 2009 4:57 pm
thank you Dr Chee for speaking up and sacrificing for us Singaporeans.. we are behind you and know what to do when the time comes..
Fearful of ghosts on Mon, 23rd Nov 2009 5:20 pm
@ Potong Pasir Resident on Mon, 23rd Nov 2009 4:49 pm
No No No, you got it all WRONG.
” see, I told you so, SDP IB like yourself is simply erratic, mindless and senseless! Anyway and anyhow, CSJ and SDP had already started to dig their own graveyard!…”
Your last paragraph is weird, errie and obviously self-contradictory proving of your stupidity. Mindless is just thoughtless and senseless, how could it be erratic?
Your past paragraph sounds like a CONSISTENTLY, mindless and senseless ghostly cobras hissing from your Pappies IB’s graveyard.
Very frightening. I am scared of ghosts like even even in broad daylight.
Let the truth be told, CSJ and SDP are smiling happily today because they know the Pappies are living on borrowed times.
As the undertaker on the sideline, I am happy. My business, which has been quiet recently, should be very good once the election gets underway!!!.
LeeLL on Mon, 23rd Nov 2009 5:22 pm
Bryan T,
You are either braindead or naive to swallow the propaganda
from the 133th and still sinking MsMs
Tell me how exactly how our Parliament works for your interests?
Did you agree to 7% raise in GST?
Did you agree to the obscene raise in the Minister’s salaries?
Did you agree to the ever tightening of political freedoms
like the Film Act, Public order Act or ISA etc?
Did you agree to the transfer of money from reserves to public
companies and GLCs?
Apparently these laws were passed in our rubber-stamped parliament without much debate.
What exactly have our 2 wimpy opposition MPs done to challenge
the PAP on the national level? When challenged in Parliament,
I still remember Chiam’s ” If the MM says so, it must be so”
remark. and LTK’s totally cowed non reply when challenged
by LHL over WKS.
They are opposition leaders for goodness sake and should have
the guts to act like one
I have no doubt if CSJ were in Parliament, we can see a
different performance
Fearful Of CSJ on Mon, 23rd Nov 2009 5:48 pm
Fearful of ghosts on Mon, 23rd Nov 2009 5:20 pm
Actually hor, I think many are not so fearful of ghost as they are more fearful of SDP and CSJ, and to a greater extend, fearful of characters like “Fearful Of Ghosts” leh!
Potong Pasir Resident, there’s really no need to engage further with such mindless and senseless SDP IB as you had mentioned earlier, we will simply ignore CSJ and SDP in the next election so that they will su-ka-liao all their nomination deposits if they do happen to compete in our consituency, but PLEASE REMEMBER to support the other opposition parties, OK?
Fearful Of CSJ on Mon, 23rd Nov 2009 5:57 pm
“I have no doubt if CSJ were in Parliament, we can see a
different performance”
Sure, CSJ will become the biggest clown in Singapore parliament history…oh boy, that will be really fun and at least turn the serious parliament proceedings into much more entertaining and humourous sessions.
Perhaps, if CSJ do ever get into parliament due to PAP mismanagement of such “once in while freaks”, then Mediacorp should seize the opportunity to telecast “live” all the parliament proceedings, as everyone would definitely enjoy being entertained by a clown in Singapore parliament…wow, big big business potential hor?
Potong Pasir Resident on Mon, 23rd Nov 2009 6:15 pm
Fearful of ghosts on Mon, 23rd Nov 2009 5:20 pm
You are indeed very scary but entertaining, and had proven my observation of SDP’s Internet Brigade being erratic, mindless and senseless. Just don’t go round scaring the hell out of everyone in broad daylight, now that you know how “powderful” you are!
One important afternote – please do not insult the undertaker’s, as they’re definitely much more noble than a character like you!
Adios…better not stayed engaged with you for too long, else will get nightmare tonight!
deoxin on Mon, 23rd Nov 2009 6:36 pm
I agree. If CSJ in parliament, we’ll see a totally different performance. It’ll be a comedy show; “diplomatic” personal insults + fight on who can deliver the most sensational headline on tomorrow’s paper.
If he has significant seats:
The parliament, from the alleged “rubber-stamp”, will turn to be single-issue parliament: Political Freedom. It won’t be debates on ‘issues’, but they’ll be debating on “the right to debate the issues”.
Creating job for people is second, the first priority is to give people right to demonstrate to demand for job.
Singapore’s progress r solely benchmark by it’s position on the list compiled by every major “human rights” group in the world.
Judging on his defense of typo on his corrupt allegation, and his refusal to defend that position, ..if he becomes PM, he’ll be the Singpore’s ChenSuiBian.
Fearful of ghosts on Mon, 23rd Nov 2009 8:30 pm
@ Potong Pasir Resident on Mon, 23rd Nov 2009 6:15 pm
No need to be scare of me this charming undertaker.
When your time is terminally near. Let me know please.
I guarantee you a biggest NICIEST FLORAL north of the South Pole and bill your family accordingly.
Oh, I love sick minds like yours to bury. Why? BECAUSE THEY ARE ERRATIC, MINDLESS AND SENSELESS – an ambivalent package of novelty rarity.
All those Pappies I have nobly “sent” were just CONSISTENTLY mindless and senseless.
Must respect you for your uniqueness!!
Fearful of ghosts on Mon, 23rd Nov 2009 8:42 pm
Fearful Of CSJ on Mon, 23rd Nov 2009 5:48 pm
Security in numbers?
Don’t worry. I am nice and noble.
This undertaker is very resourceful. He can bury two in one day or in one box if you cannot separate from Potong Pasir Resident.
Nothing personal, it is just business.
Lehman Brothers on Mon, 23rd Nov 2009 11:38 pm
@deoxin:
I would much rather have CSJ convert parliament into something like this:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5xUy2inkGHQ&feature=related
than to have the status quo where MPs actually sleep during parliamentary debates.
fpc on Tue, 24th Nov 2009 3:42 am
//deoxin
I disagree. Once CSJ gets into parliament, you will heard issues other than the ones you raised.
He already gotten in, those hr issues are not relevant anymore.
fpc on Tue, 24th Nov 2009 4:05 am
The best part is if CJS is voted in, we won’t blatant loss of monies by TH and GIC and the excessive tendency by PAP to pass tax laws that hurt the middle and lower class and pushing up hdb prices to cover up losses by GIC/TH.
Of course, CSJ is no superman.
We are know that. He can’t possibly do it alone.
For him to be elected, Singapore must have been milked to the core by PAP that the locals will vote for anything but PAP.
It is not his fault, he went on elections and won.
It is PAP’s fault for failing the country first.
btan on Tue, 24th Nov 2009 3:48 pm
Whether you support CSJ or not, he has enough supporters that he should deserve at least a seat in parliament. Why would you want to deny others their fair representation? After all, you already have 82 PAP MPs.
I can never understand why some would want to oppress others when it does not serve their purpose. How does it help YOU when yet another faceless PAP MP get into parliament via the back door?
What can CSJ, who is only one man do, to 80 over PAP MPs? Are you so afraid of him to kick a ruckus? If you truly thing he will do “damage” to parliament, that really say a lot of his capability isn’t it?
stylometry on Tue, 24th Nov 2009 5:27 pm
QUOTES
“Finally, it is worth considering the meaning of patriotism because the question of who is – or is not – a patriot all too often poisons our political debates, in ways that divide us rather than bringing us together.”
“In other words, the use of patriotism as a political sword or a political shield is as old as the Republic.”
“…defenders of the status quo often accused anybody who questioned the wisdom of government policies of being unpatriotic.”
“As Mark Twain…once wrote, “Patriotism is supporting your country all the time, and your government when it deserves it.”"
“So let me say at this at outset of my remarks. I will never question the patriotism of others in…. And I will not stand idly by when I hear others question mine.”
anothercorrection on Tue, 24th Nov 2009 6:02 pm
@Lehman Brothers on Mon, 23rd Nov 2009 11:38 pm
the debate is fascinating!! however, i do not believe CSJ is the kind that will make our parliament more like UK one.
i believe he’ll probably make our parliament more like Taiwan one: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qZ-hNVfTZqw
he doesn’t give impression as someone who cares about people; he’s more like someone “all out to get PAP”, to settle his own personal vendetta.
to me, he comes across as someone as much a dictator as he accused LKY to be. he’s just as much as power hungry ..remember how he kicked Chiam away from Chiam’s own party?!
he comes across “attention hungry” rebel. the way he twisted/exaggerated his story, like when he said that he’s been jailed for 7 times. where in fact, most of times he were just fined, but he refused to pay fines. (singapore is a fine city! people r fined for spitting, smoking out of place, jaywalking, etc. ; if u dont pay fines, u go to jail. is it fair to say that “people r jailed for jaywalking, spitting, n smoking”? ..absurd!!)
in short, if we use MSM as gauge and say that MSM is middle-to-right for being gahmen friendly; CSJ’s view is extreme left. if MSM is gahmen mouthpiece, i am not sure how i would rate his view .. it’s out of scale!!
Wake up on Tue, 24th Nov 2009 6:15 pm
To all who wrote that Chee is using foreign funds and being “eccentric, irrational and erratic”.
I AM STIL WAITING FOR YOU TO PROVE YOUR ACCUSATIONS, WHAT EVEN THE DURAI-KILLER STRAITS TIMES CANNOT DO.
MM and the rest have called him a “liar, cheat and disillusional” WITHOUT PROVE.
None of such labels are used on the PAPpies, but anything that put them even remotely in a bad light are SUED.
While they do not allow their integrity to be damaged, they themselves go about damaging other people’s integrity WITHOUT PROOF nor FACT.
This reflects the quality, the character, and the type of person we have at the present regime.
Yes, politics is dirty.
However, who has the DIRTIER laundry, the ruling regime or the opposition, is evident.
Lehman Brothers on Wed, 25th Nov 2009 10:21 am
//anothercorrection
Do check SDP’s website once in a while, and read their manifesto. The argument that Chee only has a personal vendetta against the PAP and does not offer viable alternatives is an untruth that is spread by the MSM. The SDP’s manifesto includes policy suggestions such as minimum wages, scaling back GLCs, and education reform.
Source: http://yoursdp.org/index.php/the-party/our-manifesto/the-economy
The events that led to Chiam’s departure from the SDP is very different from the myths perpetrated by the MSM. FYI, Chee actually pleaded for Chiam to stay, while the latter left the party on his own accord after differences in opinions. There was no ousting at all.
Source: http://yoursdp.org/index.php/truth-about/faqs
I seriously hope that you don’t believe the MSM’s portrayal of Chee to actually think that he will start a fight in parliament. Use an IP Proxy to watch “Singapore Rebel” and videos of Dr Chee’s actions during the IMF meeting on YouTube and you’ll see that the SDP actually stands for NON-VIOLENT protests.
Even though I don’t think CSJ would convert our parliament into a boxing ring, I would argue as an aside that it is better for the fighting to take place within parliament than for it to take place out on the streets.
LeeLL on Wed, 25th Nov 2009 10:35 am
anothercorrection,
you certainly need a correction to your correction.
If you are so not well informed about what exactly happened
with the SDP during the Chiam-Chee tussle, it would
help if you would keep quiet rather than spill hearsay,
conjectures that you sourced from the internet and make
you look like a fool.
As for choosing jail to being fined, there are some people who still stand by principles and only lesser people like you
would take issues with that.
Tell that to Dr Lim Hock Siew, Chia Thye Poh and ask why
they chose jail than to save your dictators face
PeterL on Wed, 25th Nov 2009 3:17 pm
All these rhetorics is a waste of time.Identify yourselves and join SDP for the next election and don’t use lame duck excuses of being penalized by the govt.or ISD.Workers party was successful,Chiam See Thong against all odds stood his ground for umpteen years.Hopefully Kenneth can do better than his father.The rest of you hiding behind a veil get out and be a man.Chee for all his rhetorics is a TRAITOR for seeking foreign help.Comparing Burma & Singapore is like comparing Proton to a BMW no contest.
Anti strayed dogs on Wed, 25th Nov 2009 3:34 pm
Another mad dog barking up the wrong tree here? Typical of Pappies running dogs barking at any strangers.
BryanT on Wed, 25th Nov 2009 4:14 pm
@btan on Tue, 24th Nov 2009 3:48 pm
“Whether you support CSJ or not, he has enough supporters that he should deserve at least a seat in parliament.”
If CSJ and SDP have enough supporters, he won’t be kicking his supporters to get off their butts in the latest article posting at SDP’s website.
Let me quote:
- “Being passive observers is not an option. Without supporters getting actively involved in the campaigns, elections will remain an academic exercise.”
- “The PAP triumphs not because of the approval of Singaporeans but because of the apprehension of opposition supporters.”
- “But we cannot do it alone. We need all the help we can get from you, our supporters.”
Apparently, SDP supporters are not as fervent as what we were given to believe. I also suppose CSJ’s earlier speech on youtube reminding us “Why the SDP is expanding” is just propaganda.
btan on Wed, 25th Nov 2009 5:21 pm
@BryanT on Wed, 25th Nov 2009 4:14 pm
I go by our last election results.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Singapore_general_election_2006
SDP has 4.07% of votes out of those who voted. Assuming those that voted is representative of the entire voting population, that means 4% of parliamentary seats should rightly belong to SDP (which is roughly 3 seats).
3 seats which belonged to SDP has been robbed by PAP with the current system heavily favouring them.
Not to mention the other 29% of opposition voters who have insufficient representation.
Taxation without representation. Do you support such a system?
Democracy rising on Wed, 25th Nov 2009 5:21 pm
BryanT on Wed, 25th Nov 2009 4:14 pm
Is there such a thing as “enough” supporters?
When the election comes up, many “dormant” seeds will germinate into active fervent supporters. Hopefully the Pappies don’t get wet and dirty in the underpants.
You will see the supporters sprouting all over the place. Until then, be patient.
PeterL on Wed, 25th Nov 2009 5:23 pm
Anti strayed dogs:
Every election shows SDP clearly that they do not have the support, show yourself and not hide behind close door and yelp from behind,you won’t get arrested for voting SDP talk is cheap but cheaper still are those that yelps behind closed doors.Why turn to foreigners to say what you need to say or throw stones from afar.
btan on Wed, 25th Nov 2009 5:24 pm
@PeterL on Wed, 25th Nov 2009 3:17 pm
So what are YOU doing?
Anti strayed dogs on Wed, 25th Nov 2009 5:50 pm
PeterL on Wed, 25th Nov 2009 5:23 pm
You are right on this one – throw stones from afar! Anti strayed dogs ALWAYS THROW BIG STONES on wild dogs from afar.
Why?
Unlike the less vicious even adorable domesticated pets, Pappies wild dogs simply attack every stranger they come across whether the strangers are on the blogs like a lone writer or commoners walking the streets to the supermarket.
RSPCA won’t allow me to shoot at these wild dogs but since they don’t round out rabies-infected wild dogs and they are menancing, I would certainly love to throw a big stone on its nose.
Better that it is a good throw! You don’t object to that, do you?
PeterL on Wed, 25th Nov 2009 6:39 pm
What am I doing? I’m doing fine in my little REDDOT surrounded by a sea of GREEN. I am not frustrated with what I have in my little three room flat fully paid.I’m fine I have a polyclinic walking distance from my home,I’m fine that whenever I need any anything 24/7 there is 7/11 just around the corner. I’m fine whenever I need a chauffeur driven car there are thousands just a phone call away,What else?? Oh yeah I am not frustrated because others are better off than me,I’m not envious when others are better qualified than me and most of all I do not blame others for my failures least of all a govt. that provides me equal opportunities for education and opportunities based on my merits and capabilities and not my RACE and OH!!! one last thing, I don’t get thrown out of 15 storey buildings if I disagree with the govt. or get bludgeon to death while in a lock up.What more??? My family and I love our little REDDOT and I don’t vote PAP but Workers Party to hear an alternative view from Low in Mandarin and Sylvia in English I will miss Siew but hopefully Kenneth would be a great replacement but Chee???when there is nothing good to say best not said.
PeterL on Wed, 25th Nov 2009 7:18 pm
I was taught to love even flea infested strays as a home can be found for them as for those who are anti strays where is your love.If you cannot love a stray how can you have love in your heart.If you were hurt sometime somewhere in your life and lashing out,I empathize with you and may you find peace in good time.
Drugged By PAP Cheap Wine on Wed, 25th Nov 2009 7:38 pm
PeterL
Peter, why are you still here ? You should head for the US because they have much more conveniences in life there than those available here. Much much more. They got welfare (no work also got money) and cheap medical facilities, and housing loan so cheap and even poor unemployed (not credit worthy) also can get loan from government mortgage, you can defame the President also won’t get court order, you can buy Playboy magazines from the newstand, hey man, you can also go make fun of your leaders and still tomorrow no ISD at your door. In fact, there are so much more to enjoy there.
So can this PAP bootlicker please pack his bag and be gone from our sight?
Chia Thye Poh, Lim Chin Siong and the others also wanted to enjoy all those good things that Peter mentioned. But that delusional world enjoyed by Peter could only be offered to them only if they sign a piece of paper. Peter you are lucky you were not one of those picked up during that time, otherwise all those things you mentioned would exist only in your dreams in your detention cell. But then, I guess if you were one of them, within 24 hours before the torture even began you would have confessed to anything and everything that they wanted you to say isn’t it ? After all, why wait until now then start your bootlicking ?
Oh by the way do drop by the one-roomers to see those old fellas living on scraps with barely $1 or $2 to spend for survival everyday. Also next time when you go out look out for those old folks collecting discarded cartboxes and cans. Hey, they also got 7-11 next door and polyclinics nearby and buses and MRT and taxis and provision shops at their front door. You see Peter, when they were younger they pay and pay, and they pay until broke. Now got no money how to go 7-11 or take bus or MRT to go see movies or eat at restaurants.
Wah Peter you lucky man lah. Not everyone in Singapore so lucky like you lah. Wake up and see the real Singapore lah. Every time government say free this or that for Singaporeans so many people go queue up. I know you don’t have to go join the Q because you already got everything.
I think we all also should be PAP bootlickers so that we can be like Peter got everything.
Anti strayed dogs on Wed, 25th Nov 2009 7:52 pm
PeterL on Wed, 25th Nov 2009 7:18 pm
Good imagination and a little poetic thought on “peace” and “love”. Better still a little humility was displayed by these concluding words..” when there is nothing good to say best not said…”
EXACTLY RIGHT – the moral of the story is respect contrary views, and dispute as you may wish to disagree, BUT DON’T TELL OTHERS WHAT TO DO WITH THEIR LIVES.
You will most likely get one choking right down your throat willingly or unwillingly.
PeterL on Wed, 25th Nov 2009 8:51 pm
Wow!!! frustration does make one froth in the mouth.This is my country and I am proud of it.I am not a politician or a PAP bootlicker but a citizen of a wonderful country which gave me the opportunity to live a decent life.I don’t yearn for more than what I have and I don’t envy others for what they have.As for the less privilege there are always two sides to a story.I am not here to judge others or teach others how to live their lives and why should I leave a country that I love.Its those who are not happy that should leave and no one is stopping you from doing it period
Anti strayed dogs on Wed, 25th Nov 2009 9:28 pm
PeterL on Wed, 25th Nov 2009 8:51 pm
..”Identify yourselves and join SDP for the next election and don’t use lame duck excuses of being penalized by the govt.or ISD…”
Above is NOT telling others on how to live their lives???
Time to swallow it.
PeterL on Wed, 25th Nov 2009 9:47 pm
Ok ASD like Zoe Tay’s advert “I Swallow” but I still stand by what I say that this is my country and I am proud of it and should anybody slime my country and people I will defend it with pride if not what the hell am I staying here for.
Drugged By PAP Cheap Wine on Wed, 25th Nov 2009 10:13 pm
PeterL
Wow this wonderful country giving him opportunity to live a decent life. Exactly the point ! Nobody is arguing that it’s not a wonderful country. We all know it’s a wonderful country, and we are all trying to prevent the PAP from destroying it, bit by bit, part by part.
If everyone is like you sit back and enjoy yourself everyday without a care what the PAPies are devising or planning to do next with our money and our lives, we would have become a total police state by now (just like East Germany was, and just like North Korea is). Thank goodness we got opposition politicians willing to make sacrifices for us, like JBJ, and Chiam See Tong, and Low Thia Khiang. Their mere presence in Parliament acts as a watchdog over the PAP, and even though they do not have the numerical strength to veto PAP policies, at least they put paid to them having a free hand in whatever they want to do.
Before JBJ’s entry to Parliament, all buyers of HDB flats have to use only one lawyer to do their conveyancing – Ms Lee & Lee. When JBJ got into Parliament after the Anson bye-election (1981), he objected to this unhealthy practice in Parliament. Knowing this game could now not be played, the government then relented and allowed a panel or 4 or 5 lawyers into the HDB list.
If everyone is like PeterL, and if JBJ also behaved like him, today our HDB buyers would still be held to ransom by the monopoly of Ms Lee & Lee.
The PAPies want Singaporeans to behave like PeterL because it is then easy to control the country. In return for their passive support, the ISD will not hound them, and the IRAS will not pull them up for delays in tax submission. So, PeterL, the fact that you are now leading a good, contented, and satisfying life is because you have been minding your own business all along. Even your neighbour asking for help you just quickly close your door (otherwise you get into trouble with government). When you see JBJ or Chiam or Low on the street you quickly change direction, less ISD take down your particulars. YOU HAVE BEEN LIVING A PRIVILEGED LIFE BECAUSE SOMEONE ELSE FOUGHT FOR YOU, FOR YOUR RIGHTS AND EVERYTHING ELSE. Remember that, you ingrate.
Drugged By PAP Cheap Wine on Wed, 25th Nov 2009 10:20 pm
And by the way PeterL, I saw your PAP badge accidentally falling out from your pocket when you stretched to post that comment. Next time hide your PAP membership badge properly, keep it out of our view. So how much are they paying you for that round of PR and damage control job?
Holier Than Thou on Thu, 26th Nov 2009 12:12 am
We know this site has been infiltrated by a lot of pro-PAP goonies who pretend to post comments as concerned citizens, and they are the ones giving all the holier than thou image of the government and all their achievements.
And we know who they are. The more they try to dissociate themselves from the PAP, the more they vindicate our suspicion. Remember you PAP lapdogs, you can fool some of the people some of the time, but you can’t fool all the people all the time.
Robox on Thu, 26th Nov 2009 3:48 am
PeterL on Wed, 25th Nov 2009 9:47 pm
Re: “I still stand by what I say that this is my country and I am proud of it and should anybody slime my country and people I will defend it with pride if not what the hell am I staying here for.”
If you are think that the grandiose claims that you are making above compensates for your chronic lack of self-respect, you cannot fool me.
The “Singapore” that Dr Chee speaks out against refers to the SINGAPORE GOVERNMENT; that would be THE GOVERNMENT LED BY THE RULING PAP.
It doesn’t refer to ANYTHING ELSE that constitutes Singapore.
What the heck do you think people mean when they say something like “Saudi Arabia has the death penalty”?
THEY MEAN THAT IT IS THE SAUDI ARABIAN GOVERNMENT – AND NOT ANYTHING ELSE SADI ARABIAN – THAT HAS IMPLEMENTED LAWS INSTITUTING THE DEATH PENALTY, YOU BLOODY UNSELFRESPECTING PAP FOOL!
And if people make a statement that “Saudi Ariabia has the death penalty” and mean it with disdain, they are actually speaking out against the Saudi Arabian government’s role in instituting the death penalty, and depending on the capacity they are speaking in they could be applying pressure on the Saudi Arabian government to rescind the death penalty – they are NOT saying anything about any ordinary Saudi Arabian or anything else Saudi Arabian, STUPID FOOL!
As an opposition MP, it is no big secret that that DR Chee is against the PAP-led government; he, like EVERY OPPOSITION politician including the ones that you are claiming – to support, have never bothered to hide that fact.
Hovever, because your ego is so fragile and takes the place of any self respect that you could have had (but unfortunately pathetically lack in), you automatically think that a Singapore opposition politician denouncing the actions of the Singapore government is actually making a personalized attack against YOU.
That’s what happens when people have an overinflated ego in place of self respect are like: they think that EVERYTHING is about “Me, Myself, and I”.
Grow up!
Dr Chee doesn’t even know of your pathetic existence; he cannot possibly be having YOU in mind ewhen he speaks out against the PAP government.
Instead of praising Singapore for all the convenient amenities that you have within walking distance, you should denounce the Singapore government for giving you only two brain cells to think with and handicapping you severely.
Robox on Thu, 26th Nov 2009 3:50 am
To Holier Than Thou on Thu, 26th Nov 2009 12:12 am
Re: “We know this site has been infiltrated by a lot of pro-PAP goonies who pretend to post comments as concerned citizens…”
Unfortunately, many genuine opposition party supporters have joined in as well. They have to be countered as well.
KNN on Thu, 26th Nov 2009 4:01 am
LHL is a real traitor who sold away our citizenship cheaply. What has CSJ done that hurt anyone in Singapore ?
Robox on Thu, 26th Nov 2009 4:13 am
To Holier Than Thou on Thu, 26th Nov 2009 12:12 am
Re: “We know this site has been infiltrated by a lot of pro-PAP goonies who pretend to post comments as concerned citizens…”
So does the site admin. But they will not do ANYTHING to deter it because they don’t believe that to defeat the PAP, you would have to first defeat the PAP IB.
Perhaps this is TR Admin’s way of revealing its true political affiliations.
Still, I don’t agree that it is only the PAP IB that is behind these unwarranted attacks; many genuine opposition party supporters do also join in because they are too politically inastute to be able to see how their own interests – even if they are not vested in the SDP – will be severely compromised by doing so.
To those people, I am determined to teach them a lesson and help to ensure that the theoretical minimum of nine MPs/NCMPs in the next Parliament will also be the maximum. And those nine will be have much more in common with the PAP MPs that they are trying to unseat than the any bona fide opposition members.
In short, we are going to continue having PAP rule with the help of ‘opposition’ MPs. Like Low Thia Kiang, Sylvia Lim and Chiam see Tong. So much so that we have to wonder why these ‘opposition’ supporters don’t vote for the REAL PAP MPs instead if that’s what they want.
Work against MY interests and I will be happy to reciprocate.
Robox on Thu, 26th Nov 2009 4:50 am
PeterL on Wed, 25th Nov 2009 3:17 pm
1. Re: “Workers party was successful…”
Doing what?
By being able to expand their number of seats in Parliament from one full MP only to a grand total of one-and-a-half? And this ’success’ even after their leader, pork-ribs soup hawker Low Thia Kiang being proclaimed – along with Mousey Tong – to be an ‘honourable gentleman’ in the PAP mode? This even after their party not being harassed by the political gangster Lee Kuan Yew (May His Pacemaker Malfunction!) and having all the opportunity to grow?
And ’successful’ at what else?
By the walkout of minority race members this year from their Chinese chauvinist party that aims to match the PAP’s Chinese chauvinism?
By the pork ribs soup hawker Low Thia Kiang joining 13 others of his true colleagues in the PAP and slamming Viswa Sadasivan’s maiden speech as NMP, a speech that had much support from the opposition parties’ support base?
By the law-trained good-for-nothing hawker stall assistant Sylvia Lim claiming that Singapore’s laws are fair and just, and thus she can just sit on her fat ass in Parliament not criticizing any of our unconstitutional laws?
2. Re: “Chiam See Thong against all odds stood his ground for umpteen years.”
Chiam See Tong.
You must be quite delusional if you think that were as many odds stacked against him as there were against JBJ, and now the new chicken-to-kill as an example to the Frightened Monkeys, Dr Chee.
Still, is this the same ‘honourable gentleman’ Chiam See Tong who has been in Parliament for a quarter of a century – umpteeen years, you say – making him the longest serving opposition party MP but remains a one-man party to this very day? (It was only within the last few months that I was again reminded of the name of his party after having forgotten it for years.)
And what are his ideas for party growth – and mind you, his shirking of this aspect of his responsibility as an opposition politician has yet to be discussed anywhere?
An alliance with parties that we don’t normally hear about even in the online media, like SJP and PKMS?
Having first – it was rumoured – his wife, then his daughter take over Potong Pasir because his benefactor Lee Kuan Yew (May His Pacemaker Malfunction!) has assured him that Potong Pasir will not be affected by any redrawing of boundaries?
If all of the above is ’success’, then I DON’T want any of this dubious success; I am happy to settle for Dr Chee’s ‘failures’ because despite not having a single seat in Parliament, there is a whole slew of the SDP’s policy initiatives that have right now become topics of national discussion.
Dr Chee’s failures have a far greater impact on Singapore in one year than the combined ’successes’ of all the ‘opposition’ MPs for all the years that they have been in Parliament.
Drugged By PAP Cheap Wine on Thu, 26th Nov 2009 12:26 pm
Robox
Yes you said it all. The bottomline is Singaporeans wants a credible opposition in Parliament, not to destroy the incumbent’s majority so that anarchy rules in the house (like in Taipei) but more as a low ranking policeman, the very sight of him being enough to put maintain a minimum amount of decency in the decision making process.
As to your point on the opposition’s lack of party development initiatives, etc. let it also be known that the PAP is also devoid of this. All the new PAP candidates (and those who subsequently became minister after the elections) are co-opted into the PAP just before election time. These are people one day before that had no commitment nor alliance with the PAP. They were persuaded and robed in under a banner of carrots, some with big ministerial salaries hanging at their front door. By and large, the remaining hardcore PAP cadres who have been duly committed to its manifesto has been left in the cold, but could only give their 2 cents worth by pulling along the bullock cart.
If Chiam See Tong is a one man show for SDP and now what ? (can’t even remember what his new damn party is called) so is LKY, he is also a man PAP show (the rest are flag carriers).
deoxin on Thu, 26th Nov 2009 2:29 pm
Dr Chee related his struggle to Gandhi, Aung, etc. But i think ..he’s more like PAD of Thailand, who believes and does everything in NON-democratic way ..with excuse to fight dictatorship n uphold democracy.
In election people cast their vote. YOU cast YOUR VOTE. it’s YOUR VOICE. WTF about being selfish, ‘ego’, etc. BS!!! Election is the time for YOU to have YOUR SAY! it works like that here, it works like that everywhere. don’t be fooled to support someone else’s cause, YOU should support only YOUR OWN CAUSE; if you don’t, noone else will!! however/hence, if you believe Dr Chee’s VOICE is YOUR VOICE, then by all means VOTE for his party.
One should be mindful, in politic.. everyone fight for power. they need ‘the power’ to implement their ideas, to direct the country as how they think it should be directed. So, when Dr Chee talks about “DEMOCRACY” ..ask him, WAS HE ELECTED TO SDP’s CEC?? WAS THERE ELECTION IN SDP?? when he talked against LKY’s heavy-handed treatment of dissenting-voice, ..ask him HOW DID HE HANDLE DISSENTING VOICE IN CHIAM-SEE-TONG EPISODE?
I believe CSJ is attributable to why S’porean ’scared’ of politics. If u r one who ’scared’, ask urself why r u ’scared’? r u ’scared’ for badmouthing gahmen in kopitiam? r u ’scared’ for scolding Town Council or HDB officer? r u ’scared’ for scolding policeman? if u r honest, most of u will admit that u r not ’scared’ of critising gahmen’s policy, u r ’scared’ for what u see in people like Dr Chee!!
Neutral people can see clearly how Dr Chee has led SDP into a ‘cultish’ movement. They silent every dissenting voice, ridicule other opposition; the SDP followers hv all been brainwashed that their leader is only true democratic hero in singapore ..despite him doing anything n everything in the opposite of ‘democratic’.
PeterL on Thu, 26th Nov 2009 3:33 pm
I am 65 a year old retiree just learning the rope on IT and found it exiting to sent in my 2cents worth of comments.The response & rhetorics was beyond my expectations but let me begin by saying I am no PAP sycophant or LKY worshipper.I sang God save the Queen in primary school and Majula than Negara Ku back to Majula during my secondary school and the start of my working career if I can call my job a career.My early life was a SIT flat in Alexandra where we have pigs as our walking companions.My career started in a European trading co. as a store hand with a starting salary of $90 per month not per day.I stayed in the company for forty years retiring as a storekeeper with a salary of $2,000 a 3room HDB flat we bought as a family for $7,000 which we are still staying in never owned a car and eating in a restaurant is a luxury.My retirement CPF will see me through the rest of my life happy and contented.I don’t smoke,gamble or drink,and most of my neighbours from the same generation are quite similar except for a few as I said earlier I am not here to judge others but I live by my code of living within my means.I do not see why I should not say or write some comments in praise of my country.I will never, repeat never trade my little REDDOT for anywhere in the world with my limited qualification and capabilities.I had ideals like all young men but knowing my capabilities I remain where I am and leave it to others who are more capable.I thank this blog for allowing me to say my piece and I hear what others say and write with no malice and I bless them for their noble aspirations and I sincerely wish them well.This is my country and this is my home and I have no other.I can be no match with words and writings of the new generation and will bow out gracefully not in defeat but having a chance to say my piece for my generation and my country Singapore Sri Temasek.As for all Singaporeans with differing ideals and aspiration this is the only land we have and I hope we do not have to lose it to our Green neighbours through our own folly.I am willing to meet my fellow Singaporeans to hear my views personally without any agendas just leave your contacts and I will gladly have coffee with you in YakKun or Kiliney kopi tiam.Shalom,Peace & Salam.
Lehman Brothers on Thu, 26th Nov 2009 6:24 pm
//Deoxin
Democracy is not about voting for your own cause, and only your own cause. That is simply majority wins, the system we see in “Survivor”. If everyone voted only for their individual causes, then minority groups would lose out. Democracy is about voting for yourself AND for your country. The two are not necessarily mutually exclusive, since in the long run, what is good for your country is good for your children and descendants.
Unfortunately, the PAP preys on Singaporeans’ lack of political knowledge. When facing an electorate with mindsets like yours, all they have to do is dangle upgrading carrots before elections and watch the votes roll in. They can make all kinds of disastrous errors in between elections, but the carrots ensure that they are voted in. That is why they try to keep the people tolerant of one another such that no conflicts break out on the street, but at the same time, not too close, lest the people unite against them.
Regarding Chiam’s supposed ousting from SDP, here’s your answer: http://yoursdp.org/index.php/truth-about/faqs
Your last paragraph is extremely ironic. You talk about a cult movement with followers who believe that their leader is the true opposition hero in Singapore. Do you need to be reminded about which political party recently released a book of their history that was even adapted into a comic strip? Do you need to be reminded of which political ringleader appears in the papers practically every week?
//PeterL
Cool story, bro!
Thank you for allowing us to hear the past, and perhaps it is a result of the gulf between our ages, but I have to disagree here. I am indeed thankful that I don’t have to live among pigs, chickens, and other kampung animals, and that the flat I live in is serviced by amenities conveniently placed nearby. I am not thankful however, for the hundreds of billions lost by TH and GIC during the financial crisis, nor do I enjoy the rising costs of living that have not been matched by rising wages.
While you have exited the labour force and are now enjoying the fruits of your labour, I am about to enter in a few years, in a time when the global economic climate has never been more uncertain. All that I see is a government that has failed to ensure that I will have a job that pays enough to support my family, nor affordable housing for us to live in. While you are satisfied with your past, I worry for my future. I only hope that I will still be able to view Singapore the way you do when I get to your age, no matter how unlikely it is.
Newbie on Thu, 26th Nov 2009 7:18 pm
PeterL
Which part of Alexandra did you grow up in ? Funny I don’t remember any SIT in Alexandra area. I grew up in ABC do your know where’s that area and why it’s called ABC? (if you stayed in Alexandra you would know). Pigstyle near SIT flats in Alexandra ? That’s like Mars to me.
There were no SIT flats in Alexandra area. The only SIT flats were in Dawson Rd (blue glass), Forfar Square (14 storeys), and those along Prince Charles Sq, Prince Phillip Ave area. And there were certainly no pigstyles or farms there! So where exactly ? There were only 2 places with pig farms around the area. One was opposite the flats at Queen’s Crescent (but these were early HDB built flats and the village farms are quite a distance away). The other area with pig farms was at Bukit Merah, directly opposite the present Queensway Shopping Centre (we called that area Ban Chuan). But there were no SIT flats there, mainly kampong houses.
So what’s your point ? You didn’t do enough homework before you came up with that story. You can fool the others but not those who stayed in Alexandra area before.
deoxin on Thu, 26th Nov 2009 7:35 pm
@Lehman Brothers on Thu, 26th Nov 2009 6:24 pm
defining democracy requires a long debate; but, like u say, what’s good for country is eventually good for our children. similarly, what’s bad for the country ..will be bad for our children (correct?). i believe, nothing is perfect; if gahmen make such bad mistakes, they will be voted out eventually no matter what carrot they dangle.
so, again, i believe the question should be ..whether the carrot they dangle is worth your vote? be mindful that they’ll be there for 5-6 years, is it worth your vote?
my last paragraph is a continuation of the point that every politician (or political party) has the same goal: get the power necessary to implement own ideas! like what PAP’s MP has been accused of believing everything gahmen/MSM says, SDP supporter believes in whatever Chee says.
I feel their believe is so far that it looks like a “cult”. Look around, if u and AhBeng hv disagreement on political matters, then AhBeng insults u of being PAP’s dog, being stoopid, false opposition, LKY’s stooge, etc, etc ..i can almost guarantee u that AhBeng is an SDP’s supporter.
Doesnt matter whether u r indeed die-hard PAP supporter or member of WP, if AhBeng is indeed an SDP supporter and he disagree with u, he’ll insult u all the same.
(You may argue that other parties’ supporter sometimes do the same too, but for me, the level of insult is of different level, uncomparable intensity.)
PeterL on Thu, 26th Nov 2009 8:17 pm
Lehman Brothers:I was about to exit permanently till your posting appeared.I empathized with you and pray that things will end well for you when you retire and those following later.May GOD BLESS our little REDDOT and all its people the good the bad and the ugly.I will now exit and thank you all Ladies and Gentlemen for all your comments.
Anonymous on Thu, 26th Nov 2009 8:59 pm
@ Lehman Brothers on Thu, 26th Nov 2009 6:24 pm
…”If everyone voted only for their individual causes, then minority groups would lose out. Democracy is about voting for yourself AND for your country.The two are not necessarily mutually exclusive, since in the long run, what is good for your country is good for your children and descendants”
ABSOLUTELY!
You are a true patriot! Not a narrow-minded worm which will respond to carrots dangled before their greedy eyes and stupid mind.
You see that in Potong Pasir and Hougang residents in 2006. Dangled in front of them free abalone breakfastr porridge and $100 millions of upgrading, they give the DUDs two fingers “UP YOURS” and stayed with the Opposition MPs.
As I keep reminding all for weeks now, after APEC, the next inducement would be bonus payment to civil servants before calling the election. Well here it is,
http://news.asiaone.com/News/AsiaOne%2BNews/Singapore/Story/A1Story20091126-182516.html
1/4 months one-off bonus capped at $750 right on the back of talking up the economy of “recession officially over” crap which the stock market don’t buy any of this rubbish propaganda. Smart money in stock mrket knows this is ABSOLUTE RUBBISH – the stock market hard farted a small sound to clap this “great economic news”
Election will be very soon. SOME FOOLS WILL GET SUCKED IN by this poisonous chalice of monetary baits.
But the majority will see through the cynical hypocrisy just like voters of Hougang and Potong Pasir in 2006.
PeterL on Thu, 26th Nov 2009 9:20 pm
Newbie: I hope this will be my last post before I exit.:.Alexandra Road stretch from Singapore Steam Laundry to end at Pasir Panjang Road.You are quite right the vicinity consists of all those you mention I was from Prince Philip Avenue on the right coming down from Singapore steam laundry now known as Delta House.On the left were the govt.daily rated quarters stretching to Odin Square and Thye Hong biscuit factory.Behind the daily rated quarters is Tiong Bahru and Redhill or better known as Ang Sua before the great fire.Prince PhiliP was next to the “SAI TANG” if you were from my generation and the SAI TANG is next to Tay Miang Huat Distillery.YEAR 1953. Prince Philip was known in the local dialect as “AH LEK SAN TAR TAI TZE LOR”. Having pigs as walking companions going to school along Alexander Road was than common together with the smell of the Sai Tang choking wine distillery and freshly baked biscuits from Thye Hong.I guess you need to ask your Dad or Grandad to verify if you were from that area during my time.Once again goodbye and may blessings from above be with all of you.
Newbie on Thu, 26th Nov 2009 10:18 pm
PeterL
Ok I gotcha. From your more detailed description it appears you do know the area. My apologies for jumping the gun.
I was staying at ABC, near the fire station in my younger days.. The area was named as such because there was a brewery called Anchor Brewery Company (adjacent to present Queensway shopping Centre). We later moved to Prince Charles Square, and then to our own HDB flat at Henderson Crescent. Yes your mention of Odin Square did bring back memories, especially in 1969 when there were troops patrolling the area (because of the May 13 racial riots on Malaysia).
Anyway, i don’t remember any pigs in that vicinity. There was a sawmill at the present Henderson Industrial Park though.
Once again, my humble apologies. Since you are the religious type, I shall sign off wishing you the same, that blessings be upon you.